World Cup 2006, thread funf (semis and onwards)

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Can we keep this one free of England-related stuff, and just concentrate on the teams left in it?

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:38 (eighteen years ago) link

How many goals are left in the tournament, sadly I fear about 3 or 4!

― Ronan (Ronan), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:41 (eighteen years ago) link

predictions then:

France 1 Portugal 2 (penalty in extra time)

Germany 0 Italy 1 (penalty in extra time)

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:43 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost: That sounds about right. Neither Portugal nor France have been what you could call freescoring whirlwinds. Perhaps Italy will surprise everyone and go for all-out attack against Germany? I doubt it.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Where can we rake over the coals some more? I have a scab I want to pick.

― Dave B (daveb), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Sssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh........
Be gone from this place. It's not for your sort.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:46 (eighteen years ago) link

The other thread, Dave, as suggested. The one with "4-2" in the title.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:47 (eighteen years ago) link

I think the only truth left in the World Cup now is that it's there to lose rather than win. It's gonna be the team left in the final four that makes the smallest fuck-ups that's going to win it.

I would like to see Lippi switch Italy back to the free-scoring 4-4-2 we were playing at the turn of the year against Germany, but I'm guessing WC semi-finals means Tight and Cagey.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Monday, 3 July 2006 14:50 (eighteen years ago) link

I've gone from wanting France to bundle out in the group stages to wanting them to win the thing.

Ditto. I'm pulling for a Germany v. France final.

― gbx (skowly), Monday, 3 July 2006 15:01 (eighteen years ago) link

For the first time, i'm really torn between who i want to win. I've liked watching Germany, have a spot spot for Italy, adore ZZ and admire Portugal (largely through club loyalty). What to do!

― Pete W (peterw), Monday, 3 July 2006 15:03 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm 100% behind France against Portugal, maybe 60/40 in favour of Germany against Italy.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 3 July 2006 15:04 (eighteen years ago) link

Ger 2-1 Ita (from behind)
Fra 3-1 Por

admire Portugal (largely through club loyalty)

Strangely, I don't thrill to the idea of Nuno Valente showing off his WC winners' medal to all and sundry at the Bellefield training ground next month, a la Ray Wilson.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Monday, 3 July 2006 15:04 (eighteen years ago) link

ooh, Frings banned. Italy's chances have just gone up massively, as have those of Ballack getting that booking, as he'll be called on to play more defensively. It's apparently the Italian press who've stoked the fires on this, so that'll be interesting.

― Dave B (daveb), Monday, 3 July 2006 15:25 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm pulling for the germany v. france final as well

― ai lien (kold_krush), Monday, 3 July 2006 15:28 (eighteen years ago) link

As I just started to say on the other thread, before remembering it was reserved for scab-picking, I like the look of Italy.

Lehmann, Friedrich, Metzelder, Mertesacker, Lahm, Schneider, Borowski, Ballack, Schweinsteiger, Podolski, Klose

Lahm's been fun. I like Schweinsteiger, but after the first game he hasn't done much. Ballack's been slightly subdued, been very good, but not done anything startling yet.

Goals for: 10 Against:3

Italy (probable): Buffon, Zambrotta, Materazzi, Cannavaro, Grosso, Perrotta, Pirlo, Gattuso, Totti, Toni, Gilardino

I'm not sure about Toni and Gilardino, but I LOVE watching Totti and I think Pirlo is great. He can pick a pass. The defence and goalkeeper are the best left in the tournament.

For:10 Against 3

I reckon Italy have more potential matchwinners, and that they'll go all the way.

― Jamie T Smith (Jamie T Smith), Monday, 3 July 2006 16:17 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy

For:10 Against 1

Sorry. Duh!

― Jamie T Smith (Jamie T Smith), Monday, 3 July 2006 16:18 (eighteen years ago) link

Frings is out??

ruh-roh.

― gbx (skowly), Monday, 3 July 2006 16:43 (eighteen years ago) link

OH SHIT

DO I GO DO FUN, OUTDOORS 4TH OF JULY REVELING TOMORROW, OR BE ANTI-SOCIAL AND STAY HOME AND WATCH GAMES?????

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK

― gbx (skowly), Monday, 3 July 2006 20:47 (eighteen years ago) link

WATCH GAMES THEN FIREWORKS!!
drink during both. no problem.

― wmlynch (wlynch), Monday, 3 July 2006 21:05 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm supposed to go tubing on a river! with beers and girls!!!

― gbx (skowly), Monday, 3 July 2006 21:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Predictions :

France 2 Portugal 0

Germany 2 Italy 1

― CaliforniaKlinsy (Dough Boy), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 02:27 (eighteen years ago) link

beer and girls win. be an american, damn it!

― jergins (jergins), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 03:42 (eighteen years ago) link

Probably three bad games, 3 goals max and I fear a final deciced on penalties.

A Germany - France final would be sweet though, sort of "let's win this for Battiston!" revenge plot and Zidane holding the cup in his last game ever. Too good to be true I'm afraid. :(

― Omar (Omar), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 07:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Four bad games - let's not forget the thrills of the third-place decider.

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 07:57 (eighteen years ago) link

Actually, I'm looking forward to the semis. I think France will win 2-1 and Germany will win on pens after a 1-1. I want France to win the whole thing now, I think, but Germany are my sweepstake team so I'm keeping an eye out for them too.

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 07:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Third-place decider is usually a cracker - 3-2 last time with a goal after 11sec!

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 08:00 (eighteen years ago) link

germany haven't lost in Dortmund, and have never beaten Italy in World Cup competition. The last time there was a semi-final it was the 4-3 cracker. Something will give.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 08:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Materazzi and Deco to make a difference when they come back. Por and Ita to make the final with a 2-1 score.

― xyzzzz__ (jdesouza), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 08:55 (eighteen years ago) link

What, Materazzi to make a difference by conceding several dangerous free kicks and gettign sent off, you mean? Or do you think he'll repeat his only good game ever?

I thought Nesta was fit now. It's a pretty easy choice between him and Materazzi if so.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 09:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm glad that Materazzi has answered that text message question of yours, Mark. That's why we got rid of him at Goodison.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 09:37 (eighteen years ago) link

I heard yesterday Nesta is most likely out for the rest of the WC.

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 09:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Prelim recommended sentences in match fixing trial:

Juve - relegated to C1, docked 6 points, stripped of last two titles

Milan - relegated to B, docked 3 points

Fiorentina and Nazio - relegated to B, docked 15 points

Clever - the points deductions mean that upon appeal, they can scale them back and look like they've softened the blow. Not clear whether the points deduction apply this year or next.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 09:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Materazzi also scored.

Well surely many not so good players have their best games at a WC, in the same way that some great players have their worst games in their national colours at a WC.

Yes i didn't think Nesta would be fit for the semi-final, at least.

xp = Maybe half of the Italian squad will be jailed between the end of their semi-final victory and the final, meaning Por win the trophy for the first time.

― xyzzzz__ (jdesouza), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 09:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Prelim recommended sentences in match fixing trial:
Juve - relegated to C1, docked 6 points, stripped of last two titles
Milan - relegated to B, docked 3 points
Fiorentina and Nazio - relegated to B, docked 15 points

Clever - the points deductions mean that upon appeal, they can scale them back and look like they've softened the blow. Not clear whether the points deduction apply this year or next.

So can someone who is clued in, Dave B perhaps, speculate as to whether there actually will be a mass exodus of players from these teams?

Also are there no financial penalties? Surely Juve will just storm back up the leagues, though they aren't amazingly well supported are they?

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 09:53 (eighteen years ago) link

it was weird how Fiorentina came back up to Serie A the LAST time they got booted down for irregularities. i can't remember the details or what happened to the squad. but they did bounce back fairly quickly.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 09:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Could it be last season's tally, to stop Lazio and Fiorentina getting into Europe?

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:00 (eighteen years ago) link

good piece in current LRB on Italian scandal. (subscription site alert)

www.lrb.co.uk/v28/n13/foot02_.html

― Pete W (peterw), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:03 (eighteen years ago) link

It depends - last time around when something analogous happened at Fiorentina, most players left, but one (name escapes me, used to play for Juve beforehand) stayed, saying that as the club had been bankrupted paying his and his teammates' wages, then it was morally incumbent upon him to start again in Serie C2.

However, I suspect most will leave, because they won't want to work their way back up. Some like Buffon I can see doing it, to become a Juve legend, but others like Ibrahimovic, Vieira, nedved, etc, didn't sign up to third division football.

Juve's support isn't so much in the stadium, as all over Italy. Think Man Utd with crowds of 20K.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah I remember it was Angelo Di Livio that stayed.

I guess for the likes of Nedved it's move or end your career in Serie C and B.

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Angelo DiLivio, Dave. He took a 95% pay cut I believe. But, yeah, everyone else vanished to all the other clubs.

Juve have been seriously considering becoming a touring football team with no home ground, anyway. The theory being that they can attract bigger crowds in, say, southern Sicily or Reggio Calabria than they can in Turin.

(xp)

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:11 (eighteen years ago) link

So Inter champions, if this goes through?

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:14 (eighteen years ago) link

I am disappointed there has been no FRINGS AINT WHAT HE USED TO BE headline as yet.

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:18 (eighteen years ago) link

I got really into watching the cup in while in Europe over the last couple weeks (and I've pretty much never watched pro soccer before). Does anyone know when the last three games are going to be on in the U.S.?

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:18 (eighteen years ago) link

What's absolutely fucking retarded is that the Italian FA still haven't decided if Juve and Milan will be representing Italy in the Champions League next season. They've got until the end of the month to submit their participants to UEFA, or else face almost certain expulsion from the major two european tournaments. They've already been chucked out of the Intertoto this season.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:21 (eighteen years ago) link

Fiorentina were allowed to skip a league on their way back up.

I'm reading a book on Italian football history at the moment. All these things were happening right from the word go.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Jordan they're on in the US at the same time as they're on everywhere else!

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:25 (eighteen years ago) link

(haha JtN me too, I have also been waiting for a THESE FOOLISH FRINGS variant but no joy yet)

― Tim (Tim), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Dom - The whole process has been timetabled by the UEFA deadline - national associations must report to UEFA who their entrants are in the CL and UEFA Cup by July 28th - the tribunal has been compressed and lost one stage in the normal process, meaning the decision will be made in the next week or so, and any appeal (read - the appeal) will be completed by July 27th.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:29 (eighteen years ago) link

VERY BAD FRINGS

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:30 (eighteen years ago) link

So the final game is on...Saturday?

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:36 (eighteen years ago) link

DIRTY PRETTY FRINGS

(According to the Guardian, Hidetoshi Nakata has retired from football, that seems a shame.)

― Tim (Tim), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:54 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS PAST

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 10:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Does anyone know when the last three games are going to be on in the U.S.?

Jordan, here's the schedule I have (all the following in Eastern Standard Time, convert as necessary):

Tues Jul 4 at 3 pm Germany vs. Italy (ESPN and Univision)
Wed Jul 5 at 3 pm France vs. Portugal (ESPN and Univision)
Sat Jul 8 at 3 pm EST Third-Place (ESPN and Univision)
Sun Jul 9 at 2 pm FINAL (ABC and Univision)

Also, FWIW, Univision seems to rebroadcast many of the matches at 7:30 pm.

― Collardio Gelatinous (collardio), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:00 (eighteen years ago) link

EVERY FRINGS MUST GO

― Tim (Tim), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:01 (eighteen years ago) link

ALL FRINGS MUST PASS

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:06 (eighteen years ago) link

TIm how could you forget? -

FRINGS FALL APART

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:07 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS WHEN YOU'RE WINNING

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:08 (eighteen years ago) link

NOFRING* TAKES THE PLACE OF YOU

* actually Borowski

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:08 (eighteen years ago) link

I'D DO ANY FRINGS FOR LOVE (BUT I WOULDN'T DO THAT)

― Tim (Tim), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Props to the Irish Examiner.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:09 (eighteen years ago) link

I considered almost all of these puns when I posted the link to the news report on the other thread but then thought it would be really clever to pun on the correct pronounciation of Frings before deciding I really couldn't be arsed either way.

They Frings It's All Over. Rubbish, innit?

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:09 (eighteen years ago) link

THE LINESMEN ALL SAY FRINGS NICE

German star watches 1940s films in the Referee's hotel.

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:11 (eighteen years ago) link

I hope Germany get to the final, so Kinsmann gets the chance to shout:

LET'S PUSH FRINGS FORWARD

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:11 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS, LIKE A WALK IN THE PARK. FRINGS, LIKE A KISS IN THE DARK

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:12 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS CAN ONLY GET BETTER.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:18 (eighteen years ago) link

TORSTEN TURNED

i'm also hoping for BITTE(R) LEHMANN tonight.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:21 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS TO DO

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:21 (eighteen years ago) link

AND NOW JURGEN-A BELIEVE THEM

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:22 (eighteen years ago) link

KLOSE BUT NO CIGAR

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:22 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS (PUNS) THAT MAKE YOU GO 'HMMMMMM'

― haitch (haitch), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:25 (eighteen years ago) link

WORK THAT MERTESACKER

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:50 (eighteen years ago) link

PUT AWAY THESE CHILDISH FRINGS

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Jordan, here's the schedule I have (all the following in Eastern Standard Time, convert as necessary):

Thanks dude. The third place game was what was throwing me off, I didn't know they did that (sorry, I've never really watched pro soccer until the last couple weeks).

I hope I get Univision among my seven channels at home.

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 11:58 (eighteen years ago) link

predictions:
germany 0-1 italy
france 1-0 portugal

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 12:06 (eighteen years ago) link

ALL KAISER EVERY FRINGS REMIND ME OF ULE

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 12:08 (eighteen years ago) link

I am at home today, that is why my BRANE is working so well.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 12:09 (eighteen years ago) link

I hope I get Univision among my seven channels at home

Looks like no, so only the final game for me. :(

― Jordan (Jordan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 12:20 (eighteen years ago) link

After the Italians win because the Germans' talismanic captain doesn't even make the bench:

KLINSMAN DROPS A BALLACK

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 12:21 (eighteen years ago) link

I think I meant UWE, not ULE.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 13:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Ladbrookes go 8/1 on both semi-finals being a draw in 90 minutes.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 13:11 (eighteen years ago) link

(many xposts): I don't think Fiorentina got booted down for corruption - I think they actually went bust. I left Italy just as it was all kicking off, but I was under the impression that Fiorentina ceased to exist, and the fans formed a new club (called something like Florenzia or Firenze) which the Italian FA let into Serie C2. I assume they were allowed to bypass a division or two on their way up because it was problematic them getting crowds of 25,000 or so and playing teams who get crowds of 500.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 13:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, they went bankrupt and are now officially named Fiorentina Viole.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 13:39 (eighteen years ago) link

They went bankrupt, yes, although the owner (Vittorio Gori) was charged with money laundering and cocaine possession.

They were forcibly relegated from B to C2, won C2 and then were given a place in Serie B on 'sporting merit', thus skipping C1. For one season only the Italian Federation decreed sixth place would be enough to earn a promotion play off against the fourth bottom side in Serie A (Serie B had more clubs than normal because Catania fielded an illegible player and so the four clubs who finished in the Serie B relegation positions were reprieved), although Cosenza were then
expelled for financial problems).

That's a summary cobbled together from about three sources.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 14:27 (eighteen years ago) link

Catania fielded an illegible player

Glad to see the Italian FA is coming down hard on scruffy handwriting.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 14:51 (eighteen years ago) link

That's right. There's now a provision called 'Lodo Petrucci' which means a club can be declared bankrupt, can take one relegation, and the title to the new club rests with the mayor of that city, who forms a new club, and hands it over to the new owners. That's what Torino did last year, when the old one imploded.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:03 (eighteen years ago) link

best league in the world!

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:06 (eighteen years ago) link

Germany and France in the final, is that the consensus?

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:14 (eighteen years ago) link

I think I almost want Ger-Por to get lots of people in England backing Germany and bring about a historic turnaround in relations betwixt our great nations.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Haw-haw wants Ger-Por.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:22 (eighteen years ago) link

BAD FRINGS HAPPEN TO GOOD PEOPLE

― Alex in SF (very late) (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:25 (eighteen years ago) link

ALL GOOD FRINGS MUST COME TO AN END

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:26 (eighteen years ago) link

If they get wistful about what Torsten brought to the earlier matches:

REMEMBRANCE OF FRINGS PAST

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Or if they decide to look towards the future:

BETTER FRINGS TO COME

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:31 (eighteen years ago) link

BORED OF THE FRINGS

― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:32 (eighteen years ago) link

EVERY LITTLE FRING HE DOES IS MAGIC

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:33 (eighteen years ago) link

It's getting harder and harder to hate on Germany - I just hate the idea of them winning a fourth World Cup before England have won...anything else at all.

But perhaps even worse for France to win TWO World Cups in very little time.

Perhaps if Portugal won it would make England look better? But would be a sorry state of affairs for that to happen still.

Ergo, Azzzzzurri all the way.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:35 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS AREN'T AS BAD AS THEY SEEM

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:36 (eighteen years ago) link

WHEN SMOKEY FRINGS
Torsten warned over 'quick ciggie' relapse

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:38 (eighteen years ago) link

(if you can't beat 'em etc.)

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:38 (eighteen years ago) link

ALL THE FRINGS HE SAID, ALL THE FRINGS HE SAID/RUNNING THROUGH MY HEAD, RUNNING THROUGH MY HEAD

(this is really a source of endless hilarity isn't it?)

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:38 (eighteen years ago) link

I LOVE EVERYFRING

― gbx (skowly), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:39 (eighteen years ago) link

WIND BENEATH MY FRINGS
Torstern warned over currywurst relapse

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:39 (eighteen years ago) link

COCK: FRING

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Ergo, Azzzzzurri all the way.

Rubbish. We can't have Italy pulling away further away from us. They have their 30 years of hurt due in Euro 2012.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:46 (eighteen years ago) link

FRINGS ARE TOUGH ALL AROUND

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Alba OTM: GER are so far ahead they're uncatchable. We should reserve our self-serving spite for those closer to our own level.

― Tim (Tim), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:52 (eighteen years ago) link

Denmark?

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:53 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm quite up for the idea of starting a bandwagon of hate for some arbitrarily chosen nation.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Why does everything have to relate to England in some way? Can't people just appreciate the end of the World Cup in its own right? I'd be happy for Germany to win because they're the home nation, they've played sparky attacking football, and I like Klinsmann. I'd be happy for France to win because they've come back from the dead in this tournament, I like France (the country), I like Henry, and they've got the best national anthem. I'd be fairly happy for Italy to win, but only if they play attacking football. I don't want Portugal to win because the cheating bastards knocked England out.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 15:57 (eighteen years ago) link

I'd be happy for Germany to win because I have them in the office sweepstake. I'd be happier for France to win because I have lots of French friends and have spent many happy months there on holiday and working and there's an emotional connection, like. I'd be happiest for Italy to win because I used to live there and have seen way more top-level football matches there than in any other country and I have a stronger emotional connection to Italy than France, even if there's all that horrible corruption and stuff. I don't want Portugal to win because ~~the diving, cheating bastards knocked England out~~ you can't support everyone, can you?

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:05 (eighteen years ago) link

SUFFRING FOOLS GLADLY - Torsten only too happy to dive

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:07 (eighteen years ago) link

i'd be happy for germany to win because i sense a groundswell of changing opinion towards them and there's a bit of a brotherly thing going on isn't there? i'd like italy to win because they are carrying my money. i wouldn't mind france winning because of zizou. i don'y want portugal to win because (see above posts).

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:12 (eighteen years ago) link

I want Italy to win.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:16 (eighteen years ago) link

I got way more excited seeing France and ZZ start taking the piss out of all that Brazilian MAGICK!!111 it actually surprised me a bit.

Clearly, France will lose now, with my support.

― Suedey (John Cei Douglas), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:41 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't want Germany to win for sweepstake reasons.

I did not particularly want any of the countries I've lived in to win.

Except for Scotland!

Ha ha ha I am teh funny.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:49 (eighteen years ago) link

actually, lineker done a number of frings jokes in the very first match. i'm pretty sure he signed off with 'they frings it's all over', at any rate.

― rtccc (mwah), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 16:49 (eighteen years ago) link

ile in SLOWER THAN LINEKER SHOCKER!

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 17:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Results 1 - 10 of about 369,000 for fring. (0.40 seconds)

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 17:18 (eighteen years ago) link

Q: What comes between fear and sex?
A: Funf.

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 17:49 (eighteen years ago) link

"It was looking Klose for a while, but Frings worked out in the end", no?

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Did David Pleat just describe Gattuso as a 'splendid ferret'?

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Tyldsley seems to be on some spittle-flecked pro-Germany shit tonight.

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:05 (eighteen years ago) link

I couldn't cope with an Italy-Portugal final. A team of diving, cheating bastards vs a team of diving, cheating bastards. Mind you, a last gasp winner from Italy over Germany might be worth it purely to watch Klinsmann's reaction.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:30 (eighteen years ago) link

This has been a great half.

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Heroic Lehmann to leave Italy rueing lack of ability to make teh Pressure count, Germans nick it, obv.

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:33 (eighteen years ago) link

i know the commentators have been getting enough stick but david pleat, please...
1) it's great seeing two strikers playing with each other
2) totti needs to be tamed

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:52 (eighteen years ago) link

Bah, I came up with 'Frings Can Only Get Battered' on the last thread.

Did anyone else hear David Pleat saying the Germans were "prepared to shoot on sight"?

Also Tyldesley can fuck off with his one fact about an Italian player. He can stick Ashton-under-Lyme up his arse.

Great game though.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:52 (eighteen years ago) link

Ashton-under-Lyme!

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Lyne Regis too.

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 18:59 (eighteen years ago) link

i know! an englishman still at the world cup! a liney!

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:01 (eighteen years ago) link

i thought tyldsley was supposed to be familiar with the north west.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Cyril Regis.

Cracking first half that really was.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:03 (eighteen years ago) link

If Podolski doesn't score in Berlin he could still score in Paris.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:04 (eighteen years ago) link

like it

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:05 (eighteen years ago) link

how much has klose improved? i want him to sign for liverpool.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:07 (eighteen years ago) link

He's Klose to perfection than he used to be, certainly.

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:08 (eighteen years ago) link

and it seems the teams have gone on as they meant to have started, or something.

i don't get this 'be nice to see home nation win' thing tho. i've always hated it when this happens. just seems bit too boring/predictable.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Fast-paced stuff this. Seems all the nasty comments about them in the German press has fired the oily Mamma's boys up a little.

― David Orton (scarlet), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Perotta was particularly incensed. "I fucking hated Greater Manchester!" he barked. In German tho obviously.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:10 (eighteen years ago) link

yes, COME ON ITALY!

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:20 (eighteen years ago) link

pleat is at it again. apparently toni is "working like a trojan up front".

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:21 (eighteen years ago) link

this is the best game of the tournament so far isn't it?

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:24 (eighteen years ago) link

Tyldesley does brief Gumby impression.

(Er, Matt DC - did you somehow edit your message above?)

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:26 (eighteen years ago) link

i don't get this 'be nice to see home nation win' thing tho. i've always hated it when this happens. just seems bit too boring/predictable.

But just think of all those happy smiling faces in the stadium! I like it when people are happy. Especially lots of people.

Tyldesley does brief Gumby impression

I thought I imagined it for a moment.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:27 (eighteen years ago) link

DC is a WHORE when it comes to self-editing.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Was about to say that very same thing. Check the admin log for proof. Abuse of mod privileges! Hang him! etc

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:34 (eighteen years ago) link

I can't even tell what was edited.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:35 (eighteen years ago) link

Since when was Greater Stoke part of Greater Manchester?

They don't dive at Chelsea, you know.

What did DC edit? I hope it wasn't a racialist outburst.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:35 (eighteen years ago) link

This is Beckham territory...

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:37 (eighteen years ago) link

what, Greater Manchester?

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Woo, Odonkor! He looked good on Friday.

Oh, no, he's "the German Theo Walcott"

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:39 (eighteen years ago) link

I suspect DC made some backhanded comment about 'teh WopXors'. I can't say I'm surprised.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:40 (eighteen years ago) link

crazy decision. it wasn't a foul and it was in the area so...a free-kick outside the area. funniest was when pleat was wittering on as ballack was running in and tyldsley shouted "BALLACK!!!!" over him.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:41 (eighteen years ago) link

ha ha, yes

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Can someone explain how losing in a knackering extra 30 minutes or on penalties is less unfair than losing during the 90, like what Tyldesley just suggested?

(x post, yeah that "BALLACK!" was funny)

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:41 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm trying to think of Lehmann '24 hour' jokes now.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Battison! (not really)

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:42 (eighteen years ago) link

I think the ref's been great tonight, so far.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:43 (eighteen years ago) link

There has been a lot of sublimated-aggression-via-slightly-invasive-head-patting in this tournament.

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Ballack's become a holder midfielder' he's knackered.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

"seven years ago he was playing alongside Dave Weir, Dave Unsworth and Dave Watson"

he could've said he was serving 'the Dave Sentence'

*tumbleweeds*

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm sorry for banging on about pleat but he's just criticised "merseyside water" the tosser.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:45 (eighteen years ago) link

*ages 30 years*

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Camaranesi looks like a stressed out Italian housewife.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Lahm is really crafty

― robots in love (robotsinlove), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Tyldesley has inadvertently hit on a great solution to replace penalties. CRAB FOOTBALL.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:48 (eighteen years ago) link

camoranesi looks like this girl who robbed my kid loco "a grand love story" cd. anyway, italy deserve to win but obv it's now going to penalties so we all know what's going to happen.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:48 (eighteen years ago) link

I hate to agree with Pleat but this is a terrific match.

― Toad Roundgrin (noodle vague), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:51 (eighteen years ago) link

FUCK!

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link

gilardino then, i mean.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link

I think that's the best 90 minutes I've seen in the tournament this time.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link

I like how upthread everyone was predicting boring games of doom, yet, this has been excellent. See, kids, goal-less draws can be fun!

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link

who was the last team to win two penalty shoot-outs in a row in a World Cup of continental championship?

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link

am i watching the world cup semi final extra time on my own here? zambrotta just then, too!

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link

DOUBLE FUCK!

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:58 (eighteen years ago) link

I have a feeling that Cannavaro is so ontoo Klose and Podolski that I can't see them scoring. Not so Gilardino.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:59 (eighteen years ago) link

free kick well won there by Lahm. i rate him.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 19:59 (eighteen years ago) link

can ITALY WIN ON PENS and DESTROY THE GERMAN MYTH? if (PENS) come to pass, obv, which i think they will.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Blatant cheating by Ballack.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Practising for his new job, I guess.

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Podolski should have scored there.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:12 (eighteen years ago) link

"One for the purists", immediatley followed by CRAB FOOTBALL.

"A library of great nil-nils" - Sounds like a job for the Pinefox.

"literally delivered right on a plate"

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:12 (eighteen years ago) link

I *really* like Odonkor.

Andy Townsend wants to be taught the literal meaning of the word "literally". That ball was "literally" on a plate for Podolski.

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:12 (eighteen years ago) link

Actually, if you watch the slow motion replay closely, you'll see it was literally on a plate (albeit a very small one).

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:14 (eighteen years ago) link

you must "fancy" odonkor cos he ain't all that, ailsa.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:14 (eighteen years ago) link

this game has "classic 0-0" written all over it.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:15 (eighteen years ago) link

possibly the best thing tyldsley ever said: "there is a hero and there is a villain down there, we just don't know who they are".

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:18 (eighteen years ago) link

corblimey - great work from both keepers

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Schweinsteiger!

― robots in love (robotsinlove), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:19 (eighteen years ago) link

This is a joy to watch

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:20 (eighteen years ago) link

it's really exciting watching both teams break, even tho they're clearly too knackered to convert chances properly now.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:20 (eighteen years ago) link

Del Piero you plum!

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:21 (eighteen years ago) link

case in point just now--del piero

― robots in love (robotsinlove), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:21 (eighteen years ago) link

B-but he came off the bench five minutes ago!

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:22 (eighteen years ago) link

whoops

― robots in love (robotsinlove), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:22 (eighteen years ago) link

well it's knackering to watch too.

feel that the Germans have this now.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:22 (eighteen years ago) link

did anyone work out the answer to my question upthread yet?

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Best thing commentator has said "it's like there are two games going on here, one at each end of the pitch". HAVE YOU NEVER SEEN A GAME OF FOOTBALL BEFORE?

(I do not fancy Odonkor at all, but he seems nippy and liable to do something good, and he can defend a bit as well)

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Possibly the best-refereed match of the finals too, barring a terrifying last-minute clusterfuck.

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link

YESSSSSSSSSSSSS

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Hoboy

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link

GROSSO!!!

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Blimey! GROSSO!

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link

GOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:27 (eighteen years ago) link

NOOOOOOO!!!

― David Orton (scarlet), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:27 (eighteen years ago) link

Haha shit, whatta match

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

GOOOOOOOAAAAAAALLLLLLL!!!!!!! 222222222222

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

DEL PIERO!

(I just said to the mister, they're going to score another here)

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

absolutely phenomenal

i am actually applauding here (when i'm not typing)

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Beautiful. Grosso was Tardelli '06.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Sodding hell. Great stuff.

― David Orton (scarlet), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Game of the tournament.

― Toad Roundgrin (noodle vague), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:29 (eighteen years ago) link

Lehmann who fell to earth.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:29 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy have literally scored two late goals!

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:29 (eighteen years ago) link

i was jumping round my place like an italian.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Poor, poor Germany.

― David Orton (scarlet), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

omg what a great finish

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

that last goal! holy crap

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Gutting for the Germans, but I was just glad to see it finished in normal time. Repeated disappointment has turned me into a penaltyphobe.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Amazing!!

― CDDB (Dan Deluca), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Now that was a great game of football

― Greig (treefell), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:32 (eighteen years ago) link

My despair at the result is tempered by a feeling of privelige to have watched that.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Cor wowee!

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Quite glad England are out now, they would've been slaughtered by either team.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Congratulations to Italy and both their supporters on a tremendous achievement.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Football was the winner

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I believe the word is "blimey!"

Big up Italy, they fully deserved to win that game. And they wouldn't have if it'd gone to penalties.

(Can we all laugh at Carsmile who has missed this to go and see Alice In Chains?)

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:34 (eighteen years ago) link

Noe playing 'You'll Never Walk Alone'

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:34 (eighteen years ago) link

If the final's half as good, it'll be the best final since... 86?

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:34 (eighteen years ago) link

I want to teleport to Bar Italia right now.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link

you'll never walk alone

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link

It's the most moving rendition of YNWA I've ever heard. Normally it makes me want to smash stuff up.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link

"BALLACK!!!!"

Hope David Pleat's missus has taped the game like he hoped she has.

― David Orton (scarlet), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link

I am being strangely moved by Germans singing You'll Never Walk Alone. It reminds me of being in Seville.

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link

erm never xpost alone

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link

(xposts galore, Mike, did you not hear the Celtic fans at the final whistle in the UEFA Cup Final? It was like that. A lot)

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:36 (eighteen years ago) link

Renegade masters of their own destiny. It's beautiful.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:37 (eighteen years ago) link

(Stuart Hall is on holiday, with the ill behaviour)

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:37 (eighteen years ago) link

Congratulations Italy and both their supporters. ha ha x-post PJ beat me to it

This result has pleased me tremendously, and made getting stuck on the Victoria line and missing the first half almost worthwhile.

Fabio Cannavaro, maybe it is *you* who is the best footballer in the world, just one who defends rather than one who attacks

― Porkpie (porkpie), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:37 (eighteen years ago) link

Grosso doesn't fall over in the box for once.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Not only You'll Never Walk Along, but being sung by an Elvis impersonator.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:38 (eighteen years ago) link

not sure how the final can top that - but if France keep going it and get there it will still be special.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Lehmann was top-notch. I didn't see any cut-away shots of Khan. During the GER-ARG game Khan appeared on screen more times than Lehmann did.

― David Orton (scarlet), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:39 (eighteen years ago) link

GUTTED for Germany. But oh, what a game! That was absolutely brilliant to watch.

― Roz (Roz), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:40 (eighteen years ago) link

They've spoilt the whole night by putting that sodding Frosties advert on afterwards. Way to harsh a buzz, ITV.

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:41 (eighteen years ago) link

I watched the 2003 UEFA Cup final in a noisy pub in Balham, so didn't hear the Celtic fans, Ailsa. Tonight it was so poignant cos it was a defeat and it wasn't in their native tongue. If they'd wheeled out an oompah band to do Z-Cars I'd have been in floods.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:41 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.mostravalencia.com/fichas/leslie_caron/gigi.jpg

― A Study In Redd Scharlach (Ken L), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:43 (eighteen years ago) link

maybe we should lock Dom and Mark out of the thread ha ha

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:44 (eighteen years ago) link

and best of all, NO EMMERDALE

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:44 (eighteen years ago) link

What are they going to do tomorrow if *that* game goes into extra time? Emmerdale backlog oh noes!

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Del Piero you plum!

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:46 (eighteen years ago) link

re: (Can we all laugh at Carsmile who has missed this to go and see Alice In Chains?)

HA ! I never knew Carsmile was a retro Grunger

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:46 (eighteen years ago) link

he was a plum, now he is a peach

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:48 (eighteen years ago) link

and also all these non-contextualised versions of "you'll never walk alone" aren't more moving than when liverpool fans sing it precisely because they aren't in context.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Tonight it was so poignant cos it was a defeat and it wasn't in their native tongue.

Remove the native tongue (not *literally*, Andy Townsend fans) and, yeah, as a song of defiance in the face of last-minute defeat in a massively important game you were a couple of minutes away from not losing, that's what I meant. Moving, totally.

(xpost - I suspect the influence of Mrs Carsmile, yes?)

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link

wow i thought that was pretty kewl. i luv stalemates. it seemed to me like italy & germany were pretty evenly matched thru the whole game... how did italy suddenly go like BLAOW NIGGA @ the end

― INSANE CLOWN FOSSE (Adrian Langston), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link

I never knew Carsmile was a retro Grunger

makes *whipped* sound re 'er indoors

wait, that sounds wrong. well, you know what i mean.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:50 (eighteen years ago) link

xxpost again, er, you what?

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Michael is a YNWA Rockist. Can't cover versions be good too?

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:50 (eighteen years ago) link

They've spoilt the whole night by putting that sodding Frosties advert on afterwards. Way to harsh a buzz, ITV.

God yes. I was walking over to get the remote to turn off the telly, but then I heard that start and lept for the off switch. Fucking terrible.

Brilliant match, though. I actually don't mind Italy progressing after that performance.

― The Ultimate Conclusion (lokar), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Surely the other semi's on BBC, or else the nation's Emmerdale watching coffin-dodgers would descend on the capital?

I really wish this hadn't been on ITV, but it did at least kind of bring the best out of them.

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:52 (eighteen years ago) link

I felt on reflection Germany really missed Frings; the Germans never got their passing attack going, and part of it was the midfield. Gattuso played really well, as did Pirlo, but as well as Kahl substituted, I think they're better as they played in the quarter-final, with Borowski coming on later, rather than Schweinsteiger, who's been less of an impact player.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:54 (eighteen years ago) link

dave, the one rockist thing i'm willing to stand up is a YOU'LL NEVER WALK ALONE ROCKIST.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:54 (eighteen years ago) link

The game made me realise that I never want to hear Tyldesley or Pleat commentate on anything ever again.

Mr Wells OTM

― Porkpie (porkpie), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:55 (eighteen years ago) link

I thought Steve Ryder said something about the game being on tomorrow, which I also thought was odd.

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:56 (eighteen years ago) link

on ITV, obviously, I'm aware it's on, that's not odd at all.

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh come on, Pleat admitted he loved seeing to people playing with each other and Tyldesley admitted that people get fingered on the pitch.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Not to mention the Pleat's splendid ferret.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Wait, I realize I should have changed my screenname a few days ago.

― The Player In The Redd Cap ( Two-Headed Doge) (Ken L), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:05 (eighteen years ago) link

It's a shame that it was 2-0; the record books won't ever tell the story of how good it was.

In the mythical People's Republic of Football, citizenship should only be allowed to people who:

1) Show signs of increased perspiration, heart-rate and adrenaline after watching that match in real-time

2) Give the right answer to 'Is Didi Hamann is a fantastic player'?

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:08 (eighteen years ago) link

i don't want to answer those questions cos you're taking the piss but the answer in both cases is yes.

― michael wells (michael w.), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:12 (eighteen years ago) link

3) aren't rockist about moving and poignant singing

― ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:13 (eighteen years ago) link

He referred to Odonkor as a whippet as well.

Portugal v France tomorrow is going to be a nasty, niggly affair after all that. I have visions of Patrick Viera being sent off.

(If Didi had been playing the Germans would've won that)

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:14 (eighteen years ago) link

If Rossi had been playing etc.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Right on, sister

xpost - Frings is a poor man's Didi; the Premiership's answer to Eddie Shoestring

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:16 (eighteen years ago) link

(If Didi had been playing the German's would've won that)

The German's what? The German's ferret, perhaps? Anyhoo - which German are we talking about?

*awaits rapid Orwellian edit from MDC*

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:17 (eighteen years ago) link

Fuck - that was quick

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:17 (eighteen years ago) link

I desperately want Italy-France, and then I can actually really, really, look forward to a final and know I'll be happy with a good game and decide who to win on the balance of play.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Not the semi-final resolution Germany wanted.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Dave, why not start out the game supporting the French and then change half way through to the Italians?

― Porkpie (porkpie), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Er wasn't that what he said? ;)

― The Vintner's Lipogram (OleM), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Lord Haw Haw would never put it that plainly

― Porkpie (porkpie), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:54 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm supporting football all the way.

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 21:59 (eighteen years ago) link

I want to teleport to Bar Italia right now.

Some of us were there from 6pm. I am fucking shattered right now. Exhausted. My voice has gone completely. I am soaked through to the fucking skin with Peroni and Nastro Azzuro and cheap white wine. I nearly broke my glasses during a mosh pit-esque interpretation of "Fratelli D'Italia". But, fuck me... FUCK ME that was amazing. There were, like, 3,000 guineas around Frith Street, spilling into Old Compton Street (insert gay/European gag here), and, man... everything about it was so perfect. Gabriel Garcia Marquez said that the goal is the orgasm of football, but how I felt when Grosso put that one in... it's like a car crash, everything goes in slow motion and then all of a sudden BOOM and you're squashed and singing and cheering and crushed and kissing some random dude's flag before kissing some random dude's cheek and then the second goes in and the camera crews descend and some old dude who must be about 90 stands in front of the crowd leading the national anthem and there's this one guy opposite me in a "Fuck Berlusconi" t-shirt and I think, yeah, maybe, maybe Italy's going to be OK.

Highpoints of the postmatch: guys from the Indian restaurant across the road joining in waving flags, rickshaws being commandeered so guys can show their flag off to everyone, the one girl who got the first copy of tomorrow's Gazzetto Dello Sport with it's "I-TA-LIA I-TA-LIA" cover.

Deliriously, perfectly, fantastically happy. It's like coke plus anti-depressants squared. Just... man. I want Grosso's children.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 22:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Lasciate mi cantare
con la chitarra in mano
Lasciate mi cantare
sono un ltaliano!

― The Player In The Redd Cap (Two-Headed Doge) (Ken L), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 23:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I mean, I'm not, but some people are.

― The Player In The Redd Cap (Two-Headed Doge) (Ken L), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 23:01 (eighteen years ago) link

I want Grosso's children.

-- Dom Passantino (juror...), July 5th, 2006.

Yup, just think, if he stayed on his feet against Australia instead of diving Italy wouldn't even......oh, you mean for the goal? Sorry.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 23:04 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm so sorry Mr. Cripple
But I just can't feel too bad for you right now.
Because I'm feeling
So insanely super
That even the fact that you can't walk
Can't bring me down

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Tuesday, 4 July 2006 23:10 (eighteen years ago) link

http://static.flickr.com/49/182004797_cd493d2748.jpg

Click for full-size.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 00:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Q: What comes between fear and sex?
A: Funf.

Punchline to another German-English joke:
Es ist fast food, aber nicht food.

― The Player In The Redd Cap (Two-Headed Doge) (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 00:35 (eighteen years ago) link

yes, that was freakin amazing. amazing game, amazing goals, happy italians, happy me. and the party (and whistles and horn honking) is still going on here. little italy - street totally closed down for block and blocks, totally packed with people being CRAZY, whoa, but i've been smiling since 5:30pm (even though italian-canadians kind of drive me to distraction in the first place. ah, well, can't help but love em all and their homeland today.)

― rrrobyn sharkattack battleforcenet (rrrobyn), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 01:24 (eighteen years ago) link

My favourite Tyldesley comment came after about 30 minutes: "The Italian fans are heavily outnumbered, but they're making their presence felt. Just like on the pitch."

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 04:16 (eighteen years ago) link

stupid 5am starts. I really should've got up for this anyway though, huh?

― haitch (haitch), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 04:21 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes you definitely should have gotten up

― CDDB (Dan Deluca), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 04:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Caption please

― Mädchen (Madchen), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 06:30 (eighteen years ago) link

It feels so good. Really.

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 06:57 (eighteen years ago) link

I was at a meeting this morning and this guy was wittering on. I yelled "BALLACK" and he shut up.

It could catch on.

A great game of football last night.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 07:14 (eighteen years ago) link

I feel sorry for Klinsmann, by the way. He's a nice guy.

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 07:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Re: the caption competition

Never mind Merkel and Der Kaiser, I want to know what that creepy little bald chap on the front row is saying.

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 07:43 (eighteen years ago) link

that's actually one of the guy above's testicles, sprung to life and ready for some action.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 08:51 (eighteen years ago) link

that creepy little bald chap

Hi dere!

I wish I'd had the same experience as Dom - as it was, I was at home with sgs and a couple of friends eating hamburgers and getting increasingly fraught - Sarah pointed out you could figure out my level of tenseness by how many adjectives I used when abusing a poor German player for some imaginary foul (I got up to three, I think).

When Italy scored I felt shouting "YES!" in the sitting room wasn't enough so I ran to the front door and shouted it at the rest of West Putney, baffling courting couples and street urchins.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 09:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I wanted Germany to win but I'm not disappointed because Italy played football at last. Pirlo, Gattuso, Cannavaro, Zambrotta etc - brilliant footballers one and all. I hope they win the whole thing now.

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 09:06 (eighteen years ago) link

the brief hot coffee scolding i received on my leg as i celebrated Italy's first goal was so worth it.

― Ste (Fuzzy), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 09:08 (eighteen years ago) link

As Der Kaiser marvelled at Sepp Blatter's reconstructive facial surgery, Romani Prodi told Angela's that he would do anything for love, but he wouldn't do that.

― Dave B (daveb), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 09:22 (eighteen years ago) link

I find it interesting that English-speaking people like Klinsmann personally, because I get serious fascist vibes off of him.

― Colin Meeder (Mert), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Great game, second half was a bit scrappy but the extra-time more than made up for it.

Gilardino was really good I thought, he deserves to start in the final. Brilliant feint for the second goal too, he could have wrapped his foot around it and had a shot but he laid it off so cleverly to Del Piero.

Grosso's goal was brilliant, where has he been for his career before now, I thought he was excellent last night.

And Cannavaro, just fucking unbelievable the amount of times he blocked the ball and made tackles.

Germany's subs didn't really cut it did they, Odonkor was ok but Schwinestiger didn't seem to get much of the ball, Neuville possibly brought on too late, Klose looked completely fucked by the end of the 90 mins.

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:12 (eighteen years ago) link

Caption please

Men queue up to blow 'Der Kaiser' whilst man in red t-shirt casually rolls spliff.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:16 (eighteen years ago) link

I am only sorry David Pleat did not cry out "KLOSE, KLOSE, KLOSE TO OUR SOUL HERO IN HIS SOULMOBILE!" which is what has been in my head all tournament long.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:31 (eighteen years ago) link

I have a sneaking suspicion Portugal are going to pull it off this evening. France have been good when they're the underdog with something to prove. Much less good when they're the favourites.

― Revivalist (Revivalist), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:33 (eighteen years ago) link

So I keep reading how one name being bandied about to be the next coach for Argentina is none other than Maradona. There are lots of pictures of El Diego with his arms in the air with some writing tattooed on his forearms that I can't read. Searching "Maradona" and "tattoo" you read that he's got a tattoo of El Che on his shoulder, Fidel on his leg and, possibly, the blue and white jersey on his torso. Does anybody know what it actually says on his forearms?

― The Player In The Redd Cap (Two-Headed Doge) (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I have a sneaking suspicion Portugal are going to pull it off this evening.
One things for sure- based on my viewings of Gerald Depardieu playing flics in various films, the French will be able to go head to head with Figo when the head-butting starts.

― The Player In The Redd Cap (Two-Headed Doge) (Ken L), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:35 (eighteen years ago) link

Does anybody know what it actually says on his forearms?

I read it in a magazine, I don't want to see it again. I think it is something related to the Cuban revolution, but I'm not entirely sure. Something cringeworthy, anyway.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:43 (eighteen years ago) link

This totally gives away the fact that I'm not a true Italy supporter (just someone whose girlfriend did her undergrad in Bologna), but I wasn't writhing in pain and tension praying for the game to be over last night--I wanted it to go on forever! It was so great! This, and the FRA-BRA match, were the two best ties I've seen this tourney, but they were so different. One exceedingly 'well-played' and beautiful, the other just hard-fought, incredibly even and taut with uncertainty. And what exclamation points!

― gooblar (gooblar), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:49 (eighteen years ago) link

I predict:
England
France
Germany
Italy
No South Americans - hooray!
-- ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (dadaismu...), June 30th, 2006.

YOU ARE A JACKASS!

-- Frida (mrkd4de...), July 1st, 2006.

I know, imagine thinking England would reach the semi-finals.

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 10:50 (eighteen years ago) link

One things for sure- based on my viewings of Gerald Depardieu playing flics in various films, the French will be able to go head to head with Figo when the head-butting starts.

Such a shame France can't really add him to their line-up at this point any more... But hey, just imagine, if only! - after Portugal'll've made their third substitution, France could bring on Depardieu for the sole purpose of headbutting sorry-arse Figo un-fucking-conscious!?
Whew.

― tiit (tiit), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 11:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Grosso's goal was brilliant, where has he been for his career before now, I thought he was excellent last night.

Like quite a few of the Italian team (most notably Toni), he was still playing football at a much lower level until recently. He finally started Serie A football with Palermo, where he's been two seasons. He signed for Inter just before the tourney started.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 11:31 (eighteen years ago) link

You want a depressing thought?

At time of posting, there's a 50/50 chance Scotland will have both World Cup finalists in their Euro 2008 qualifying group.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 11:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Like we were ever going to qualify anyway

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 11:53 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes, but them both being in the final somehow makes it worse.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 11:58 (eighteen years ago) link

At time of posting, there's a 50/50 chance Scotland will have both World Cup finalists in their Euro 2008 qualifying group.

Perhaps it's (semi)finally time for Sir Macca to write - in collab with John Cleese? - the obvious footie requiem, "The Luck of the Scottish"?

― tiit (tiit), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 11:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Great nostalgia here - all world cup editions of Kicker magazine from 1970 onwards. Pictures are good, even if you can't read them.

― Dave B (daveb), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 12:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Of course Scotland very nearly beat Italy in the home qualifier back in 2004.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 12:26 (eighteen years ago) link

mark, there are no urchins in putney...

and yes i was watching alice in chains, like the dutiful husband i am, rather than the best game in the world ever...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 13:19 (eighteen years ago) link

It wasn't that good, Carsmile.

Get in the mood for tonight's Best Game Ever:

http://www.ronaldaonline.com/

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 13:44 (eighteen years ago) link

I want France to win of course but a part of me wants Ronaldo to score a winkin'-poutin'-divin' hat-trick to annoy (some) England fans

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 13:49 (eighteen years ago) link

mark, there are no urchins in putney...

Haha Steve how wrong you are :) There are, and when they're not graffiting our walls our nicking our cars they're smoking pot and eating pizza on our stairwell. Young people these days etc.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 13:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Does anyone with knowledge of these things have a recommendation on Brixton pubs to watch this thing in? When I tried the Living Room a week or so back, I was the only one in the place because the rear-projection screens were so cruddy. The Dogstar was nice but I imagine potentially less dramatic a place to watch POR-FRA than GHA-BRA.

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:06 (eighteen years ago) link

according to stattostatto:

Vasco De Gama is a mix between and English pub and a Portuguese bar with a giant screen as well as a TV. They receive Portuguese satellite TV so expect a Portuguese commentary.
152 Old South Lambeth Road, London SW8

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:14 (eighteen years ago) link

other prospects here

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Like quite a few of the Italian team (most notably Toni), he was still playing football at a much lower level until recently

yeah it's interesting, why does this seem to be the italian way? is it a deliberately lax youth system thing? english prospects are mollycoddled since birth (cue wayne rooney: street footballer guff) whereas even hyped italian young talents like pirlo usually go around the houses a little bit before finding their feet somewhere. i suppose totti, del piero and cassano have always been little princes but then i wonder if it's a coincidence that they all play in that particularly evocative position. or am i overstating the case?

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:21 (eighteen years ago) link

Missing yesterday's game hurts me in my heart. Alas. The final had best be a cracker, whoever is in it.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:23 (eighteen years ago) link

(or: luca toni vs kevin phillips FITE)

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:25 (eighteen years ago) link

What, you mean catapulted into the international setup after one prolific season, then rubbish at international level?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Just think, Darren Bent might have been England's Luca Toni

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:34 (eighteen years ago) link

kevin philips could give toni a good whack in the knee, if he stood on his tippy-toes...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:37 (eighteen years ago) link

... on a stepladder.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:41 (eighteen years ago) link

i find Toni's height refreshing.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:41 (eighteen years ago) link

well i just mean, is england the only team with this clear keeping up with the joneses "good but not ahem INTERNATIONAL CLASS" pretence? is it a sign of insecurity?

of course, you can spin it whichever way ur biased, so if darren bent really isnt fit for england it indicts the quality of the overrated premiership etc etc and so on. it's too easy to reach for the extremes of theo walcott vs michael ricketts as well.

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:44 (eighteen years ago) link

so if darren bent really isnt fit for england it indicts the quality of the overrated premiership etc etc and so on

Bingo

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:47 (eighteen years ago) link

still to be convinced that Crouch is 'more fit' for England than Bent.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Class.

http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/4540/zizouclope3kg.jpg

― Dave B (daveb), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:54 (eighteen years ago) link

is that David Blaine, Tobey Macguire and Leo Di Caprio with him?

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 14:56 (eighteen years ago) link

dadamismus do you think serie a's been an awesome exhibition of technical fitba these last couple of years as well? i was more of the opinion that it was an abject load of bollocks myself.

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:05 (eighteen years ago) link

We will be cheering for the blues Konal so I think hhis time we will steer clear of the ones you mention - thanks for the alternatives though! I think we will just rah rah rah all back to the Dogstar after all - please come along, anyone who wants to join us!

xpost is that photo recent???

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:06 (eighteen years ago) link

cor i never knew zidane smoked! he really is one of the greats.

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:06 (eighteen years ago) link

"yeah it's interesting, why does this seem to be the italian way? is it a deliberately lax youth system thing? english prospects are mollycoddled since birth (cue wayne rooney: street footballer guff) whereas even hyped italian young talents like pirlo usually go around the houses a little bit before finding their feet somewhere"

Generally, big Italian clubs lend some of their young, promising players to smaller teams, in order to get them back a little more experienced. This process can take a few years.
Grosso and Toni are different: until a couple of years ago they really were playing for smallish clubs in serie B or C. They progressed all of a sudden, becoming the players they are today. This is particularly striking for Toni: when he played with Vicenza he was widely considered an unredeemable "brocco".

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:08 (eighteen years ago) link

I have never met a French person that doesn't smoke so that ZZ picture doesn't surprise me in the slightest.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:11 (eighteen years ago) link

yeah but zz is like the holy man of football! well, in my mind anyway. i know barthez does as well. and vieira looks like he's on 60 a day sometimes...

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:15 (eighteen years ago) link

dadamismus do you think serie a's been an awesome exhibition of technical fitba these last couple of years as well?

Haven't seen any Italian football in a while, do they make a song and dance about being the best league in the world too then?

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:17 (eighteen years ago) link

surely they do

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:20 (eighteen years ago) link

actually tho I'm sick of people mistaking the "views" of Sky Sports TV on the Premiership for the views of the entire population of Britain on the same subject.

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:21 (eighteen years ago) link

no but if ur stating that bent being rubbish exposes the premiership then it would follow u think toni & grosso are products of a better situation?

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Do they also moan about the "24 anni di dolore" since their last win?

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Well if they do, they won't be doing so in a week's time.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:26 (eighteen years ago) link

actually tho I'm sick of people mistaking the "views" of Sky Sports TV on the Premiership for the views of the entire population of Britain on the same subject.

Britain?

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Photo from today I think. But most European coaches and players have taken the view that smoking fucks you up 10 years after you've finished playing, whilst booze fucks you up tomorrow when you're playing.

Sadly, I see the views of said commentators being regurgitated by a lot of people. Certainly, it forms the official line, and one which many, many people are happy to accept. Football, especially in England, is not a happy place for non-conformists.

― Dave B (daveb), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:35 (eighteen years ago) link

But isn't that line pretty much true?

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:39 (eighteen years ago) link

It's a line, I'll give you that

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:43 (eighteen years ago) link

Surely smoking affects your breathing, making it harder to run for 90mins?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Not to mention 120 + minutes.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:48 (eighteen years ago) link

I can't remember anyone ever discussing "which league is the best in the world".

― Ronan (Ronan), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 15:49 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm not 100% convinced the man in the photo is Zidane.

It's a bit like that Panini sticker of Cristiano Ronaldo.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 16:09 (eighteen years ago) link

In Spain they say they have the best league in the world too. I suppose it is some kind of marketing ploy thought up by nob-ends.

I'm going to stick my N. out and say that I don't think leagues are very good anyway. I prefer a good hard cup tie.

I am more surprised at Zidane being involved in a gay tryst in a greenhouse than at his smoking, although that does surprise me too.

It definitely affects your running ability.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 16:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Well, Gerson had a couple during half-time during the 1970 final. And there's Socrates, who smoked like a chimney.

― Dave B (daveb), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 16:10 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm not 100% convinced the man in the photo is Zidane.

That's definitely Sagnol beside him tho isn't it? The guy the doing the "Where's the titties at" gesture

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 16:12 (eighteen years ago) link

He even has his own lighter:

http://i22.ebayimg.com/01/i/05/cb/76/49_10.JPG

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 16:14 (eighteen years ago) link

On the other hand:

http://www.classesnonfumeurs.org/images/asso/home/intfussball.wmv

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 16:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Marchons, marchons...

Vive la France!

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 17:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Hey, where do I watch this online? possible?

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 18:08 (eighteen years ago) link

I would call that a dive, but Motson & Lawrenson say it was a definite penalty. Bit similar to the dodgy Italian one v Australia.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 18:36 (eighteen years ago) link

Espn's website has a streaming video thing online now.

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 18:36 (eighteen years ago) link

Haha! Ridiculous Ronaldo dive. He's not going to win any new friends tonight.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 18:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Will be interesting if we get a final between two teams who only made it because of penalties that weren't. Why the fuck there's no video refs is beyond me, instant end to bad decisions like these, and instant end to the diving and playacting that has blighted the tournament if post match yellow cards were given on video evidence.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 18:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Fuck me! 'Come On, Let's Go' by Broadcast playing over a montage of Sven moments! Genius music choice, Beeb! Sorry for the mention of Eng1and, by the way.

― yer mam! (yer mam!), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 18:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Motty & Lawro's "the entire world is booing Ronaldo out of solidarity for Rooney" schtick is ruining this match for me.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 18:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Contact - certainly. But did he actually trip Henry? No.

Henry = diver.

But then so is Figo. If you recall.

― WalkOn By (Sans Sushi), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:03 (eighteen years ago) link

They are booing him, though. Either there's a lot of English fans there, or the French were siding with Rooney. (xpost)

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:03 (eighteen years ago) link

booing of Ronaldo v. tedious. nothing worse than a bad loser.
that Sven/Broadcast thing had a genius moment, Trish singing "whats the point of wasting time, on people you'll never know" over footage of Theo Walcott!

― zappi (joni), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:06 (eighteen years ago) link

or they dont like someone diving, against their team

― -- (688), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:15 (eighteen years ago) link

But they've been booing him since kick-off, long before he dived against them. It can only be 'bad losers' if the ground is somehow full of English people.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:18 (eighteen years ago) link

it probably is. Im sure loads bought tickets thinking england would be there.
I thought it was a penalty btw.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Can't see either team beating Italy in the final on this performance.
I think Portugal are slightly better but don't look like scoring.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:26 (eighteen years ago) link

I think everyone just hates Ronaldo.

Portugal are 1-0 down in the semi-finals of the World Cup and are now playing with NO STRIKERS! Wow.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:28 (eighteen years ago) link

I thought it was a penalty too. Carvalho's right boot took Henry's weight-bearing leg off of the pitch.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Scolari = Sven!

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link

"I don't want to sound spiteful, but Ricardo Carhvalho deserves to be banned for the final for his part in the Rooney incident."

Oh aye, that's right, for partaking of the pleasure of having his knackers stamped on. Motty, you are a prick.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:45 (eighteen years ago) link

I was amazed and delighted by use of Broadcast by Beeb at half time there.

Lineker seemed a bit depressed tho.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Thank god Saha will miss the final.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:53 (eighteen years ago) link

Saha - worst player in the tournament? Played for about 10 minutes in the QF and the SF, booked in both and didn't hold the ball for more than a couple of seconds in either.

― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:55 (eighteen years ago) link

At the start of the tournament France and Italy were 2 of the most unlikely teams to make the final.

http://www.oxfordstudent.com/article_images/103/4608/0060.jpg "It's a funny old game"

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Not a great game that. Portugal got very far in this tournament for a team that never scores and plays without any strikers at times. At times it seemed that they'd forgotten that scoring was the aim, and that it was all about diving.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Utterly unconvincing last half-hour from France...and Barthez is due a real game-losing calamity. And there's only the final left.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 19:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy were fifth favourites weren't they? better odds than Spain, Portugal, Holland etc. (xpost)

Remarkable really that Scolari has failed to organise a decent supply feed for over-rated Pauleta. They actually seem so similar to England at times in these regards.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:00 (eighteen years ago) link

You realise how poor England were after seeing that Portugal performance tonight.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm afraid the BBC panel are talking nonsense now...as if last night's semi never happened simply because it was on ITV. It's almost an...ITV thing to do.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Thank fuck Ian Wright isn't there.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Portugal ripped off but hey, fuck 'em and their diving.
Don't care who wins on Sunday but I'd pay money to see Grosso concede a penalty against Henry. Not that I condone the Frenchman's devious ways but I'd forgive him just this once.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:14 (eighteen years ago) link

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h29/tolgak/index.jpg

― Porkpie (porkpie), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:15 (eighteen years ago) link

this tournament is petering out. shame, really.

i hope france's old guard have enough legs to put on one last great display. not that i really want them to win or anything, i just want to see a high-quality, tightly-fought final.

is there any chance coupet can come in for the final? i doubt domenech would do it, but it seems essential.

― weasel diesel (K1l14n), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Portugal have done well to get to three semis in four tournaments despite never having had a decent striker.

And now he's finished, I can say that I always thought Figo was a touch overrated; he was never really a galactico, more one in the eye for Barca. The fact that he was followed by Zidane, Ronaldo and Beckham seemed to make him seem to be in that category, but he was bought for different reason to all of them.

― Dave B (daveb), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 20:48 (eighteen years ago) link

the tournament's been a bit disappointing overall, really. france aren't all that, barthez is shocking. portugal were like a neutered (diving, cheating) dog. brazil were all hype and no substance. england were managed as if by someone who'd won a competition off the back of a cornflakes packet. argentina didn't deliver when it mattered. germany would have a job getting past a premiership team in the fa cup. summing up; come on italy.

― michael wells (michael w.), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:05 (eighteen years ago) link

How is this tournament petering out? We were only raving "GAME OF THE TOURNAMENT!" yesterday. Still, the disappointment across both the panel and the commentary box was palpable. Everyone looked and sounded like they couldn't wait to get away. Way to build tension for the final.

Seeing both teams play, I think 0-0 at half time would be the best possible outcome for the final. I really don't want to see either team, especially France, take an early lead.

At the end of the group stage, this was the best World Cup ever - shame some of the most exciting teams (Argentina, Spain, the Czechs briefly) cannoned out earlier than expected. Better than 2002 though. Everyone knew it was Brazil from the quarters onward.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:08 (eighteen years ago) link

The whole point of the 4-5-1 lesson from Euro '04 was that the 'better' team doesn't always win against a side that holds its shape defensively and doesn't panic or make egregious mistakes. The irony here is that Italy are more likely to play 'French-style' football and France more likley to play 'Italian-style', unless, as I suspect, they both play conspicuously dull games.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:11 (eighteen years ago) link

At the start of the tournament France and Italy were 2 of the most unlikely teams to make the final.

two of the most unlikely 26 teams perhaps?

― ken c (ken c), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:21 (eighteen years ago) link

Enjoyed the action as much as '98 (didn't see much of '02 to compare), except there wasn't one real big surprise in the semi-finals (Sweden and Bulgaria in '94, Croatia '98, Korea and Turkey in '02) - Portugal got to the final of the euros, France had the experience and just about got it together.

Today's match couldn't possibly live up to yesterday's - France sitting back on the early lead, Por not looking like scoring (unlike Brazil), so no encouragement to counter-attack.

― xyzzzz__ (jdesouza), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Despite Henry's history in this tournament of diving, I actually don't think he did tonight. I thought that the contact threw him off balance. Either way, contact without hitting the ball has been more than enough for a free kick in this tournament, and it was fair enough. Besides, the Portuguese side are chock full of diving scum. Shame France did the same thing they did against South Korea, but it says a lot about Portugal that the couldn't capitalize. France to win, despite Italy's fantastic display last night. De Rossi will be back, and he's a shitheel.

― The Ultimate Conclusion (lokar), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:33 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost: Oddly the first six or seven minutes tonight were filled with frantic end-to-end attacking, which was great, but then on some invisible signal both teams remembered to defend.

I think Italy are favourites for the final. I really don't mind who wins, I just want to see a good game (for a change - in recent times they've either been negative bore-fests like 90 & 94 or tediously one-sided like 98 & 02).

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:40 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy and France were dark horses, what with both of them having the two longest unbeaten runs in European football leading into the tournament. We all kinda of missed that.

― Dave B (daveb), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 21:58 (eighteen years ago) link

i backed italy, i didn't miss that!

― michael wells (michael w.), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 22:01 (eighteen years ago) link

me too

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 22:02 (eighteen years ago) link

(i wanted to say "me & konal ITM" but i thought it would be bad luck).

― michael wells (michael w.), Wednesday, 5 July 2006 22:16 (eighteen years ago) link

You know, I'll probably be jeered out of here, but I don't think Portugal have been any worse at cheating than anyone else. I think they had the misfortune to knock out England, whose media (and some uninformed fans) desperately needed some other scapegoat than Rooney since they'd clamoured for and hounded back a player who had broken a bone in his foot only five weeks prior to the start of the World Cup.

― David A. (Davant), Thursday, 6 July 2006 03:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Portugal were the main offenders. Just count the dives during the SF.

― dr 'I ain't English' lulu (dr lulu), Thursday, 6 July 2006 03:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Vive les bleus!

― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 6 July 2006 03:21 (eighteen years ago) link

I think the intensity of the reaction to Ronaldo is a product of the search for a scapegoat, but not the attitude towards Portugal on the whole. They (the national team, their clubs sides, and teams managed by their 'special one' Mourinho) are legendary for it, and people had been moaning about it for at least 3 years before Saturday.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Thursday, 6 July 2006 06:20 (eighteen years ago) link

My initial reaction to the penalty was that Henry had caught his laces on Carvalho's studs (or vice versa) after a slight tap to the ankle. I'm not sure now, perhaps he just dived, but there was initial contact anyway.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Thursday, 6 July 2006 07:53 (eighteen years ago) link

There was contact, but that's not enough for a penalty - Carvalho caught him for sure, but it was disappointing to see Henry not want to do what he could have done - stay on his feet as he had a clean shot with his right from 15 yards - and instead trusted Zidane more from 12 yards.

Memo to England - show team Zidane's penalty. Ask them to try and repeat the feat.

― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:14 (eighteen years ago) link

If both teams play as defensively as expected and it ends with penalty kicks, who has the advantage? Obviously Zidane is pretty good as seen lastnight but I assume Italy has some pretty good free kick scorers?

― richardk (Richard K), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:17 (eighteen years ago) link

I just saw Scolari on TV complaining about Fifa's 'anti Latin American' conspiracy. What a twat.

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:23 (eighteen years ago) link

If Saha's tackle - which was all ball - deserves a yellow card then Carvalho's is at least a foul. Henry sold it, sure, but wouldn't anyone here? Sheesh. You're in the penalty area in a semifinal! Sell it! I was reminded yesterday that fouls don't necessarily even have to exist, properly - all the ref has to do is determine that the play was dangerous. Given that I can live with Saha out for the final, and I can also live with what happened with Henry. Clho lashed out desperately after taking a tumble and hit nothing but Henry's shinguard. You just don't do that in the area.

Agreed about Barthez - not only is he a total cock, but looks set to pull a serious Bill Buckner sometime very soon.

I really disagree about the game not being exciting! Except for a mushy bit from about 50'-65' when France were laying back and Portugal were trying not to concede another goal, it looked like all guns blazing to me - although people were getting tired. Zizou was just insanely good yet again but he looked tired right from the beginning, which is worrying. The last 10 seconds (after Ricardo had gone back to his end) were teeth-jangling - I actually fell onto my hands and knees on that last play!

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Less of the quote marks round Special One, Jamie... you know it's true.

BBC have had a shocker this tournament. Motson last night managed to make Lawrenson sound like the rational one.

It's been a great WC, though. Best I've seen, anyway. Portugal are a pretty sneaky team, but the over-reaction has been embarrassing. They were more sinned against than sinners in the Holland game, didn't do all that wrong against England and the only real diver against France was Postiga (bar one from Ronaldo). It was hardly a cheatfest. Oh, and it was a pen, but Henry probably could have stayed up if he wanted to.

Now, does anybody know where all the French fans will watch the game in London on Sunday?

― Pete W (peterw), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:26 (eighteen years ago) link

In Little France, of course.

(??)

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I just saw Scolari on TV complaining about Fifa's 'anti Latin American' conspiracy. What a twat.

Almost exactly the same as the "anti Australia" conspiracy, eh doc :)

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Hmmm, those dodgy penalties eh? Now you mention it.....

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:50 (eighteen years ago) link

The other thing is, although there's been a bit of diving (and nowhere near as much as Italia 90) the refs haven't actually fallen for it all that often. They've tended to simply ignore it.

― Pete W (peterw), Thursday, 6 July 2006 08:55 (eighteen years ago) link

I think Henry went to ground just as much as Grosso went to ground, both aware that the defender had done enough to likely give them a penalty. There may have been a touch more defender-to-attacker actual contact in the Henry incident but morally I think they were pretty much identical.

And there's been a LOT of diving, if you're of the impression that any dive should get a caution.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Haven't they now been told to only book the player if they are convinced there was clearly no contact rather than if there was 'just' exaggeration?

― Pete W (peterw), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Whether its a penalty or not is beside the point. Unlike Ita-Aus Portugal had 70 mins to come back into it.

Por had their chances and were unable to take them.

― xyzzzz__ (jdesouza), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:07 (eighteen years ago) link

The second phase has been pretty dour.

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:09 (eighteen years ago) link

I was just disappointed that henry went to ground instead of shot - Grosso was going nowhere., but Henry denied his talent and thought better to pass the buck. That was weak.

― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:14 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes what a poor move for France.

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:19 (eighteen years ago) link

full-length version of the Pepsi ad

hadn't seen this one until today. especially love the glances Henry and Lampard exchange with each other.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:26 (eighteen years ago) link

I mean - "Recover balance, attempt shot" rather than "Let Zidane take a penalty" - just because it might be seen as the more manly, talented way to score seems a selfish way to play, to me.

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Memo to England - show team Zidane's penalty. Ask them to try and repeat the feat.

It was such a joy to watch. Almost like a golf swing. Obv. I have fuck all personal experience of taking penalties, but I wonder whether a short run-up gives the pressure less chance to overwhelm you.

― Alba (Alba), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:32 (eighteen years ago) link

But here we are again discussing diving/cheating/bad refereeing instead of how great some of this tournaments been. It ain't good.
xp

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:35 (eighteen years ago) link

it was like he knew it didn't matter whether Ricardo guessed the right way cos he was going to place it so well.

either that or he was gasping so much from smoking that the short run up was more attractive

― Ronan (Ronan), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Feck - that French site with all the goals in Flash video has closed down. Does anybody have an alternative?

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:43 (eighteen years ago) link

Off topic, but I've been reading a history of Italian football and it suggests that in Maradona's seven years at Napoli, he slept with around 8,000 women. That's over three a day!

I did two in a day once and couldn't walk for a week.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Thursday, 6 July 2006 09:49 (eighteen years ago) link

i am quite excited about the film shown at cannes that follows zidane for a whole game. shot by the man who brought you 'seven' and 'city of lost children'.

― Roughage Crew (Enrique), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:14 (eighteen years ago) link

"I'm gonna split you in two!" comes from Nightmare On Elm Street.

I once taught some girls whose family lived next door to Maradona in Naples, and they said there was a lot of lady-based activity going on. Cue exaggerated rolling of eyes, etc.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, I think Figo, in his heyday, was every bit the equal of the players who followed him to Real Madrid. Funny how Real Madrid seems to make great players a bit more average than before.

I didn't see last night's match properly, but I did see the handily cobbled together "daving" montage. I mean, it's very naughty and everything, but anything that riles Shearer et al to that extent has got to be a good thing on some level. They so righteous it makea me sick. Except Lineker, fuunnily enough, the only one who wasn't ever a cheat (apparently).

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:24 (eighteen years ago) link

The BBC panel were very strange, all in a big sulk. Maybe their aircon broke down, or something. Had the disconcerting experience of finding that McCoist (mostly by not being anglocentric, as the madly gone-native Hansen is) was making more sense than anyone in the Beeb's team...

― Mark M (Mark M), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:29 (eighteen years ago) link

They are a bunch of mardy arses.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Maybe they were gutted they got the crap semi.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:33 (eighteen years ago) link

What is "daving" and why is it so naughty? I so puzzled it makea me crazy!

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Daving = being an Everton defender five years ago.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:43 (eighteen years ago) link

Daving = changing the team you support every five years

lawro totally sounded like he was completely footballed out last night, but he did make a comment at one point about the previous night's hotel...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:45 (eighteen years ago) link

I liked it when they showed Abel Xavier in the crowd and then a few seconds later Motson said "an Abel Xavier lookalike in the crowd there".

Lawro was right re too much cutting to Aime Jacquet in the crowd.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Mardy arses is right.

The idea that Alan Shearer could soon be coaching the England team should not fill anybody with confidence. And anyway, didn't he get booked for diving in Euro 2000?

Mikey, what's the Italian football book?

― Pete W (peterw), Thursday, 6 July 2006 10:47 (eighteen years ago) link

I believe it's this:

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0091905613.02._SS500_SCLZZZZZZZ_V56571024_.jpg

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0091905613/026-8522550-3774838?v=glance&n=266239

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Thursday, 6 July 2006 11:04 (eighteen years ago) link

Diving, not Daving. You silly billies.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 6 July 2006 11:14 (eighteen years ago) link

Maybe Shearer was pissed off as this video had been 'leaked'.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Thursday, 6 July 2006 11:40 (eighteen years ago) link

Haha! That's almost as good as Here Comes The Crouchstepper.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Thursday, 6 July 2006 11:59 (eighteen years ago) link

I was impressed with how much he was "in his mirrors", until the goofy face at the end. Take his licence away!

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Thursday, 6 July 2006 12:06 (eighteen years ago) link

The book is called Calcio: A History of Italian Football [John Foot]. It's big (500+ pages) and came out earlier this year.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Thursday, 6 July 2006 12:27 (eighteen years ago) link

maybe petering out was the wrong way of putting it - the excitement has become far more sporadic since the groups, though - if it had happened the other way around, it would have felt more satisfying.

― weasel diesel (K1l14n), Thursday, 6 July 2006 12:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Smoking up during the game did wonders for my enjoyment of same, and I was left with a "well, we played good, penaltys will happen, no hard feelings" vibe towards the end of it. Cheering for France for the finals, as the italians do not have anyone with a name half as comical as "Zinedine Zidane".

Also, the french players totally don't know their own national anthem!

― Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Thursday, 6 July 2006 12:37 (eighteen years ago) link

I wonder if, after Maradona's third woman of the day, all the television screens in his house flashed "TURKEY!" and played a triumphant melody.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Thursday, 6 July 2006 12:39 (eighteen years ago) link

i loved that little run that miguel did before he hurt himself. shame he hurt himself though.

― ken c (ken c), Thursday, 6 July 2006 12:41 (eighteen years ago) link

i noticed during the Marseillaise that Ribery SUCEEDED in outstaring the camera, ie the director cut to something else before he moved OR BLINKED. he's a scary boy...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Thursday, 6 July 2006 12:45 (eighteen years ago) link

What do you think Klinsmann will do now? I hope he coaches for the U.S.

― Mary (Mary), Thursday, 6 July 2006 13:26 (eighteen years ago) link

so fifa have announced the Golden Ball shortlist:

Thierry Henry
Patrick Vieira
Zinedine Zidane
Fabio Cannavaro
Gianluigi Buffon
Andrea Pirlo
Gianluca Zambrotta
Miroslav Klose
Michael Ballack
Maniche

surely must come down to Cannavaro or Zidane

and also the young player shortlist:

Cristiano Ronaldo
Luis Valencia
Lionel Messi
Lukas Podolski
Tranquilo Barnetta
Cesc Fabregas

― mason storm (mason storm), Thursday, 6 July 2006 14:32 (eighteen years ago) link

No Torres?

― M. White (Miguelito), Thursday, 6 July 2006 14:42 (eighteen years ago) link

i think Torres is too old (at 22). pretty sure the young player award is 21 and under.

― mason storm (mason storm), Thursday, 6 July 2006 14:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Cannavaro and Barnetta/Ronaldo.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Thursday, 6 July 2006 14:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Not exactly one of those tournaments where the young upstarts showed the older generation how things should be. Cannavaro by a country mile for me. Germany's left back didn't get nominated, strangely.

― Mikey G (Mikey G), Thursday, 6 July 2006 14:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Lahm is like the German Phil Neville only good.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Thursday, 6 July 2006 14:50 (eighteen years ago) link

also thought Rafael Marquez should make the list

― mason storm (mason storm), Thursday, 6 July 2006 14:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Klinsi has a strained relationship with the DFB; the fact that he was the coach and the World Cup was coming meant that everyone played nice, but without the WC as a factor, maybe there's an element that normal service will be resumed. However, the feeling that he's on the verge of great things might be the deciding factor; when Der Kaiser and the head of the DFB praise you, strange times are afoot.

― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 6 July 2006 19:30 (eighteen years ago) link

The last 10 seconds (after Ricardo had gone back to his end) were teeth-jangling - I actually fell onto my hands and knees on that last play!

So did I. I'm just glad the new floor could take it.

I agree with a surprising number of people and what they have said.

― the pinefox (the pinefox), Thursday, 6 July 2006 19:38 (eighteen years ago) link

What do you think Klinsmann will do now? I hope he coaches for the U.S.

Come to England Jurgen, you know we love you really. Plus it would annoy the Daily Mail etc something rotten.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Thursday, 6 July 2006 19:49 (eighteen years ago) link

House prices in June fell by 1.2% due to higher utility bills, interest rate worries and the distractions of the World Cup.

All we need now is a permanent World Cup.

Can you arrange it please, Boyler?

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 06:51 (eighteen years ago) link

I think the young player of the tournament will be Podolski.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 09:16 (eighteen years ago) link

There was a concerted email campaign by England fans to stop Portugal winger Ronaldo from winning the award.
The Portuguese winger, pilloried for his part in the sending off of Wayne Rooney, was leading the Fifa website vote by a huge margin.

But an email urging fans to vote for Ecuador's Luis Valencia instead led to an incredible 24-hour turnaround.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 09:17 (eighteen years ago) link

Here's hoping Ronaldo wins it then. Also glad to see Mr. Elizondo has been chosen to referee the Final.

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 09:23 (eighteen years ago) link

It's ahppened, Dadismus. I was just hoping to look clairvoyant. Podolski wone because Fifa cleverly gave themselves the last say.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 09:27 (eighteen years ago) link

happened, not ahppened.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 09:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Gary Bloom wrote to me again! Yay! He confirmed that he was present, at the actual event, as it unfolded, in real time, viz a viz WC2006. Back in the UK now.

So, think on, the next time you lay into pundits and commentators. (Actually, just keep it up - Wrighty and Townsendy might be reading).

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Friday, 7 July 2006 09:29 (eighteen years ago) link

Podolski?!??! Ridiculous. it should have been Ronaldo the Winker.

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 09:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Ballack isn't playing Saturday; Kahn, however, is.

― Colin Meeder (Mert), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:11 (eighteen years ago) link

rilly? interesting (goes off and changes fantasy team for the nth time...)

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:19 (eighteen years ago) link

"Podolski?!??! Ridiculous. it should have been Ronaldo the Winker."

Except part of the criteria was 'fair play.' Pretty much ruled himself out there don't you think?

― dr still don't care about england lulu (dr lulu), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:22 (eighteen years ago) link

He dived a bit, but no more than, say, Thierry Henry

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:27 (eighteen years ago) link

Sky Italia got nuts on Tuesday

xpost - also Podolski had scored 3 and made a couple, which Christiano Ronaldo didn't.

― Dave B (daveb), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Podolski only really played well in one, maybe two, game(s) tho, The Winker was more consistently good

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:29 (eighteen years ago) link

You are playing Devil's Advocaat, aren't you?

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Portugal were so dull that I didn't really notice Ronaldo make that much impact or play as well as he did. Nobody really stands out for Italy or Germany as they've been so effective as entire units. And the French have relied on the old guard. How old is Ribery?

So, think on, the next time you lay into pundits and commentators.

Tyldesley almost exhonerates himself in this brief Observer interview as linked to on the all new, all sexy freakytrigger

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:34 (eighteen years ago) link

Ribery is young, I don't know, 22? No-one stands out for Italy!?!??! Gattuso! Pirlo! Zambrotta! Cannavaro!!!!!

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:36 (eighteen years ago) link

as i say, no-one stands out for Italy because they've been so effective as a whole.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:38 (eighteen years ago) link

and we're talking about young players really so not Cannavaro, probably player of the tournament.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:38 (eighteen years ago) link

And as for Germany: Lahm, Klose and, most of all, Frings.

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh right, sorry, young players, silly me

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:40 (eighteen years ago) link

i reckon cannavoro prob, too. although i've backed pirlo and think/hope he could be the dark horse.
as for tomorrow, i can't see anything other than a germany win, portugal prob wish they were already at home.

― michael wells (michael w.), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:43 (eighteen years ago) link

Why Italy will win:

On the date of the 1982 final, the Rolling Stones were playing in Torino. This Sunday they are playing in Milan.

In 1970 lose final in Americas to Brazil; 1982 win final in Europe against European team, 1994 lose final in Americas against Brazil, 2006 . . .

The Pope was Polish in 1982, and Italy beat Poland 2-0 in the semifinal; in 2006 the Pope is German, they beat Germany 2-0 in the semi-final.

In 1982, Italy drew their first pre-tournament friendly 1-1 with Switzerland. In 2006, Italy drew their first pre-tournament friendly 1-1 with Switzerland.

― Dave B (daveb), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:47 (eighteen years ago) link

I knew there was some reason they picked a German as Pope

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 10:50 (eighteen years ago) link

So is Gary Bloom a silent lurker on all ILE football threads, or does he google his name every single day and spend hours reading what people have said about him? (or stranger still, does he google 'Michael Jones' every day to see what he's said about anything?)

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Friday, 7 July 2006 11:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Why Italy will win:
On the date of the 1982 final, the Rolling Stones were playing in Torino. This Sunday they are playing in Milan.

This suggests to me that they will LOSE because it is in a different place. Also, no members fell out of a coconut tree in 1982.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 11:11 (eighteen years ago) link

So wait, Tyldsley is actually quite funny and takes criticism gracefully? Gah!

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Friday, 7 July 2006 11:12 (eighteen years ago) link

In 1998 Britain was led by Tony Blair, in 2006 he's still there.

In 1998 the Pope was a catholic, in 2006 this is still very much the case.

In 1998 France got to the World Cup final, and they've done it again.

The similarities are freakish. Also if you multiply all the letters in the word 'Winners' it spells 'FRANK' (which is nearly 'France').

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Friday, 7 July 2006 11:13 (eighteen years ago) link

What sort of clout does the third place game have? Do the players take it seriously or do they just want to cry and go home?

My favorite players of the game thus far: Gerrard, Lham, Abidal.

― Mary (Mary), Friday, 7 July 2006 12:27 (eighteen years ago) link

Gerrard? Errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, why?

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 12:43 (eighteen years ago) link

she likes her men to have little or no foreheads ;)

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Friday, 7 July 2006 12:54 (eighteen years ago) link

... and only ever play well for Liverpool?

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 12:59 (eighteen years ago) link

He played really well in one of the pre-world cup friendlies, if I remember correctly he was playing in a different position from his usual England role, fancy that.

― Vicky (Vicky), Friday, 7 July 2006 13:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Sorry, this is supposed to be England free.

I want Italy to win.

― Vicky (Vicky), Friday, 7 July 2006 13:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Gerrard was my gateway player into paying attention to the World Cup!

― Mary (Mary), Friday, 7 July 2006 13:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Is this the single stupidest thing that's ever been written about football?

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/martin_jacques/2006/07/one_step_backwards.html

― Pete W (peterw), Friday, 7 July 2006 13:58 (eighteen years ago) link

What do you expect, it's Martin Jacques after all

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 14:02 (eighteen years ago) link

you see, this is his error:

I haven't tried to make any precise statistical analysis of the European sides this time around but it feels that here again there has been a retreat.

IT'S NOT HARD TO COUNT is it? or even ask one of the stattos in the football department who could probably work it out in 5 minutes. but NO, gut feelings clearly superior...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Friday, 7 July 2006 14:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Personally I'm delighted to see European sides do well, the more the merrier

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 14:08 (eighteen years ago) link

"with the excellent Ian Wright"

― -- (688), Friday, 7 July 2006 14:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Ha ha, that's the killer! You know whoever writes that must be an idiot!

― ¡Vamos a matar, Dadaismus! (Dada), Friday, 7 July 2006 14:13 (eighteen years ago) link

he has UNITED all "comment is free" posters against him!!! but yeah, the wright thing is the kicker, unless he was talking about wrighty going round the art gallery, that WAS good...

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Friday, 7 July 2006 14:24 (eighteen years ago) link

What a jerk.

Steady Mike's mail is mind-blowing. Also, it echoes what I said Mr Bloom should, or might, do. So I hope that, in the ever-decreasing circle of referentiality, he mentioned me. I'm not sure I can yet gather exactly what it was Mr Bloom was referring to, though. Had someone accused him of commentating on a World Cup 2006 game without being present?

3rd-place games are traditionally excellent - France vs Belgium 1986, ooh-la-la! - and we expect Germany to turn over the Portuguese tomorrow night.

― the pinefox (the pinefox), Friday, 7 July 2006 17:14 (eighteen years ago) link

there hasn't been a World Cup final where BOTH teams scored at least one goal (penalty shootout don't count) since 1986!

given Italy's superb defensive record this time, it seems as if this odd stat may be extended. otoh perhaps Henry will take more control and be able to do something special? obv. France have other threats but will they be as effective against a team this bouyant - with potential for goal to come from all kinds of people?

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Friday, 7 July 2006 18:50 (eighteen years ago) link

I hope France beat Italy because the person who got France in the office sweepstake has goen on holiday and by the time he gets back he might have forgotten all about it and I will not have to sell all my belongings to finance the whole debacle.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 July 2006 18:55 (eighteen years ago) link

I was just about to ask if there would be a THREAD FOR THE FINAL, then I noticed that this one was very efficiently called SEMIS AND ONWARDS. Good thinking!

My hopes are well known.

― the pinefox (the pinefox), Friday, 7 July 2006 19:37 (eighteen years ago) link

i was kind of hoping for a special finals only thread.

i have no rationale for this.

― gbx (skowly), Friday, 7 July 2006 19:43 (eighteen years ago) link

PJM: Have you spent the sweepstake takings? I hope it was on a toy for Edith. Or did everyone just give you a bunch of IOUs?

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Friday, 7 July 2006 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link

My suggestion: a team of guardian jouralists should black up and enter the next tournament, and when they win (as they inevitably will, of course, unless the ref's a racist) they can wipe the make-up off and say "Da Da! Look what we have done in your honour, marginalised peoples

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 8 July 2006 00:16 (eighteen years ago) link

http://football.guardian.co.uk/worldcup2006/story/0,,1815707,00.html

Gattuso was prominent among the players who disagreed with the call made by Maurizio Paniz, an MP of Silvio Berlusconi's right-wing Forza Italia party, for a dismissal of all charges if Italy win the World Cup tomorrow. "There shouldn't be an amnesty," Gattuso said. "Those who have committed crimes ought to be punished."

I agree completely with Gattuso, but what a bizarre suggestion in the first place. I can't imagine David Cameron recommending that all burglars should be released from prison if Paula Radcliffe wins the next London Marathon.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 09:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Regarding that scandal, I've been wondering if most people outside of Italy who haven't followed this very closely are aware of the fact that no players are involved in this scandal. And why call it match fixing when it's "just" people like Moggi who have asked/demanded referees to judge in their favour. It's not like two clubs agreeing on a result, which I thought was the definition of match fixing.

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Saturday, 8 July 2006 11:28 (eighteen years ago) link

haha, no, influencing refs to rule in your favour isn't fixing matches at all!

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Saturday, 8 July 2006 12:02 (eighteen years ago) link

So, um, third place then! Er.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 8 July 2006 13:36 (eighteen years ago) link

yeah, am i going to be the only person watching this?

― gbx (skowly), Saturday, 8 July 2006 16:28 (eighteen years ago) link

No! I'll be watching!

― ailsa (ailsa), Saturday, 8 July 2006 16:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Pete W / Dave B / Mikey G: on your recommendations I've bought that Calcio book and the Vialli one. I think the woman in Foyles thought I was trying to desperately read up before tomorrow's final.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 17:13 (eighteen years ago) link

"And why call it match fixing when it's "just" people like Moggi who have asked/demanded referees to judge in their favour. It's not like two clubs agreeing on a result, which I thought was the definition of match fixing."

Yeah for example a fight isn't "fixed" IF the other fighter doesn't know about it! Cuz if the other boxer thinks that he really legit knocked the guy out in the third round then it is actually a fair fight, no matter that they guy fell down like a sack of lead weights cuz he was paid to.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Saturday, 8 July 2006 17:17 (eighteen years ago) link

well, i didn't think the cheats would be up for this but it seems i was wrong. anyone have any more info re figo? also funny to see bbc coverage so pro germany.

― michael wells (michael w.), Saturday, 8 July 2006 18:17 (eighteen years ago) link

I got emotional watching the gaol of the season competition on Football Focus. I anticipate severe withdrawal symptoms.

Hearing the crowd singing 'Oli Kahn' got me quite goose bumpy. This is his last world cup match, and the same for a few of them. I love the 3/4 match.

― Dave B (daveb), Saturday, 8 July 2006 18:36 (eighteen years ago) link

It has just occurred to me that Miroslav Klose looks like Alan McInally.

― ailsa (ailsa), Saturday, 8 July 2006 18:40 (eighteen years ago) link

How hot is Deco?!

― Mary (Mary), Saturday, 8 July 2006 18:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Another comically blatant dive from Ronaldo. Once again he's been booed throughout, right from kick-off. In the same way that this 'wasn't the French' last time, I suppose this isn't the Germans: just 15,000 English fans who cunningly bought tickets in advance for the third place play off in the hope that England would get to the semis and lose.

I got emotional watching the gaol of the season

Did Wormwood Scrubs win it this year?

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 18:51 (eighteen years ago) link

motd goal of the tounament*

(let's vote before he knockout stages, oddness or admirable foresight)

1)LAHM - not bad, i liked the way he celebrated looking like a sweaty lad you'd end up having a mixed-up conversation about faithless with at creamfields.
2) FRINGS - it looked good at the time but, you know, the ball's a bit mad
3)ROSICKY - well, he looked the world beater here, didn't he, all you fantasy league suckers
4)TORRES - it was actually a bit messy before puyol (who had a rubbish tournament, btw) managed to get rid into torres' path who finished with aplomb
5)GERRARD - i'm biased, and rightly so, he does that for us every week but for england rarely.
6)CAMBIASSO - they never looked like they were ever going to lose it 'til it was in the net did they?
7)KONE - decent goal, another "i'll welly it from 25 yards" like but...
8)DECO - he slipped on his arse, he didn't mean it!
9)J. COLE - i suppose he did mean it
10)M.RODRIGUEZ - well, that's the winner

1) m.rodriguez
2) cambiasso
3) j.cole

― michael wells (michael w.), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Bastian Schweinsteiger now officially the ugliest player to have scored in this tournament.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:12 (eighteen years ago) link

Surely Peter Crouch wins that contest!

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Scorching OG.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:17 (eighteen years ago) link

holy shit!

― teeny (teeny), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Vorwaerts Deutsche Soldaten!

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:21 (eighteen years ago) link

COME ON!!

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:34 (eighteen years ago) link

GET IN

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:35 (eighteen years ago) link

it's like he cloned his first goal

― gbx (skowly), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:35 (eighteen years ago) link

SCHWEINSTEIGER
SCHWEINSTEIGER
SCHWEINSTEIGER
SCHWEINSTEIGER
SCHWEINSTEIGER
SCHWEINSTEIGER

― Jena (JenaP), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:35 (eighteen years ago) link

Tra la la - three nil with ten inutes to go. Tra la...

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:37 (eighteen years ago) link

beautiful ball by Figo.

shame that Kahn doesn't get a clean sheet, though

― gbx (skowly), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Sweet. (Makes me happy - bloody Huth was injured in the warm-up so, in a Fantasy League sense, I did not want to see Germany keep a clean sheet).

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

The BBC commentator really can't count, can he? "Wouldn't rule out a sixth goal in this half" hot on the heels of "Germany have only conceded three goals in this World Cup...four, sorry." (Keep going).

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:47 (eighteen years ago) link

I do feel sorry for Kahn but Lehmann's my man all the way. I think Klinsmann now knows that he made the right decision for the national team.

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:50 (eighteen years ago) link

i love m o'n: "no one knows anything". he's a cut above the rest, you know. he really is.

― michael wells (michael w.), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:59 (eighteen years ago) link

O'Neill is quoting William Goldman now!

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Saturday, 8 July 2006 19:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Deutschland uber alles!

(except Italy and France)

― Dave B (daveb), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:02 (eighteen years ago) link

I also love Alan Handsome, his and MO'N's petulance is v amusing.

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Hey Dave! I was nearly lynched by *Germans* for shouting that in a pub recently!

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Schweinsteiger isn't ugly, is he? He looked fine from where I was sitting.

My mom was in Ireland when England played Portugal and she said the Irish were quite happy to celebrate England's loss.

― Mary (Mary), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:08 (eighteen years ago) link

This is shameful and true. (Does not apply to me, obv.)

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:17 (eighteen years ago) link

It's a kind of "we hate it when our friends become successful". You'd be surprised at how many bigots we have in our midst. I find it all quite unpalatable.

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:20 (eighteen years ago) link

O'Neill in terrific form throughout - can't wait for him to repeat his 'I wanna be Italian' rant again tomorrow.

― xyzzzz__ (jdesouza), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:21 (eighteen years ago) link

xxp well, obviously. when even the english are more than happy to celebrate their loss, why not everyone else?

― michael wells (michael w.), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:23 (eighteen years ago) link

She was also afeared that someone would throw bricks at their Catholic tour bus when they went through Belfast. Apparently the locals were not that friendly.

She loved your craggy, green countryside though.

― Mary (Mary), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link

They always say that about me. Oh wait...

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:31 (eighteen years ago) link

There are catholics in Belfast.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:31 (eighteen years ago) link

There's a mix, which is why the whole thing kicked off in the first place. Our country often lets itself down in its xenophobia. As a nation we'll give you a great welcome as long as you're only staying for a couple of days. But, anyway...FUSSBALL.

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link

As a nation we'll give you a great welcome as long as you're only staying for a couple of days.

Haha, Japan is the same way.

― Mary (Mary), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:40 (eighteen years ago) link

Tell me, does the depressing sense of transience at the end of the World Cup become sadder as you get older or simply arrive at a World Cup in your 20s and at each subsequent competition.

Felt it quite alot watching tonight's game...

― Ronan (Ronan), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:43 (eighteen years ago) link

it's a horrible feeling and the only feeling that counteracts it is the giddy excitement at the start of the world cup.

― michael wells (michael w.), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:51 (eighteen years ago) link

I've felt it hugely - mostly because the group stage was so fantastic. As the games become fewer and far between the cavernous gap between them seems to echo louder. God knows how I'll feel after the final.

This isn't helped by the fact that the last day of the season still hurts and the Premiership season ahead feels like a gigantic pain in the arse. It's like coming back off holiday and having to start school again.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Saturday, 8 July 2006 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm bummed because I only got really into it by the last week and now I have to wait four years, by which time I'll probably have outgrown it.

― Mary (Mary), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:04 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm now actually looking forward to the start of the new premiership season though. i'm also kind of buzzing off the fact that me and craig bellamy are on the same side this tme.

― michael wells (michael w.), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:05 (eighteen years ago) link

I, quite literally, don't remember what I used to do at 8pm most nigths before the World Cup. Couple this with the fact that my new housemate moved in with me in the middle of the group stages and I don't know whether we have anything in common or not as all we've done is watch football and talk about football.

― Lara (Lara), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:12 (eighteen years ago) link

don't worry, that's all i have conversationally in common with most people in my life. that and football. this is englnand you know.

― michael wells (michael w.), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:20 (eighteen years ago) link

That pretty much sums up my ILX world: 99% football, and about 1% other random stuff (like Names for people which seem inappropriate when given to dogs).

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:24 (eighteen years ago) link

To think after tomorrow it'll all be over... World Cup, Wimbledon... even Doctor Who's finished. Suddenly the future stretches before me, an empty, howling wilderness...
I think I've watched about 60 full games of football the past month, which is kind of shocking but it'll be wierd without it.

But when I heard about Rooney's punishment I perked up at the mention of the Euro qualifiers. Reset. Start again.

Well done Germany!

― David Orton (scarlet), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:38 (eighteen years ago) link

"Yeah for example a fight isn't "fixed" IF the other fighter doesn't know about it! Cuz if the other boxer thinks that he really legit knocked the guy out in the third round then it is actually a fair fight, no matter that they guy fell down like a sack of lead weights cuz he was paid to."

But that's not comparable to the situation in the Serie A. If one football team(ie the players) would agree to lose a game then what you say would make sense(as a comparable example).

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:43 (eighteen years ago) link

Lovelace: you're right, but you're wrong. The one-boxer-throwing-the-fight-while-the-other-doesn't-know analogy doesn't work, but obviously if a senior non-playing figure at a club ensures the referee will give his team the result he's looking for then the match is fixed even if none of the players on either side are aware of what has happened.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 21:57 (eighteen years ago) link

I have to share the fact that - thanks to Schweinfeller - I am in 25th position OVERALL in the Guardian Fantasy League. This could possibly be my finest ever football related moment.

Jamie, currently reading 'A serious case of the Blues: Chelsea in the 80s'. Not sure you'll want to pick that one up any time soon.

I'm really going to miss this World Cup...

― Pete W (peterw), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:05 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm not anti-Chelsea per se, just anti-Abramovich.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Hey, wasn't implying you were. it's just a 'specialist' read is all, (unless you want to be reminded of Tony Godden's two penalty saves at OT in 86).

― Pete W (peterw), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:20 (eighteen years ago) link

That was live on TV wasn't it? I think we were bottom of the league or thereabouts. Both penalties in the space of about a minute. Not a great day.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:25 (eighteen years ago) link

I feel like I've been run over by a cartoon steamroller. This flatness does seem to get worse each time a tournament ends. Although, for me, the prospect of next year's Premiership is a bleak one -- many demoralized or knackered returning players (van Nistelrooy, Rooney, Rio, G. Nev, Park, Silvestre, Saha, van der Sar, Vidic) and an outstanding talent who is being run out of England by the sour grapes of an entire nation (from your average punter, to the red top rags, to Shearer and the BBC). I can't for the life of me understand the sad handful of fellow Reds who have gone along with this ridiculous mean spirited scapegoating of one of the most exceptional young talents currently playing in England. Do we not remember how much they wanted to hurt Beckham in '98, and, more to the point, how we rallied around him and made him feel welcome in defiance of the rest? Oh well, I suppose Cristiano is just a greasy cheating Portugeezer, right? Fuck that.

Sorry for the slightly off-topic rant. I just heard that Ronaldo wants out, and part of his statement mentions his (perceived?) lack of support in Manchester. It's the first time I can recall us not closing ranks. We will regret this for a long time.

Anyway, tomorrow I'm going to try and forget about all that and get behind Italy down on Commercial Drive in Vancouver. Fingers crossed for a great final and an equally good after party. Forza Azzurri!

― David A. (Davant), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:25 (eighteen years ago) link

David A - he made it clear a couple of weeks ago he [Ronaldo] wanted out and wanted to go to Real Madrid. He's using the whole Rooney thing as an excuse. And he isn't Beckham 98, he's Simeone 98.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:31 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't agree with that. There was no Simeone this time. Unless you think Carvalho placed his nuts under Rooney's heel! And don't get me wrong, even though I hold Rooney responsible, he's also young (like Ronnie) and will (have to) learn, and I just hate the way England has to scapegoat someone every time they contrive to fuck up a World Cup. If Ronnie didn't want to stay at United, why did he sign a contract recently that would have taken him to 2010? I really think the English reaction to his understandable outrage at Rooney's stomp has convinced him of the basic lack of fair play in that country. The earlier Real Madrid stuff all centred on their elections after all. It wasn't like the candidate who promised to bring Ronaldo to Madrid was guaranteed a win, and in fact he didn't win! Also, Ronnie has never made it a secret that he wanted to go there eventually. This appalling reaction by the English media, pundits and your average Little Englander on the street has now vastly accelerated the process... and long before we've seen his best. I'm sickened by it, quite honestly. It's always been "United first", right? What happened?

― David A. (Davant), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:41 (eighteen years ago) link

But now I feel like I'm derailing this thread.

― David A. (Davant), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:42 (eighteen years ago) link

So: "Anyway, tomorrow I'm going to try and forget about all that and get behind Italy down on Commercial Drive in Vancouver. Fingers crossed for a great final and an equally good after party. Forza Azzurri!"

― David A. (Davant), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:48 (eighteen years ago) link

why did he sign a contract recently that would have taken him to 2010?

If I was feeling a bit down becuase I'd been accused of rape and my boss offered to pay me an extra thirty grand a week for the next five years I think I'd sign a contract even if I was hoping to go to Spain.

Anyway, like you said, enough derailment, back to the world cup...

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Fair point. And not just a bit down... don't forget his dad had just died too. But still...

I'm just feeling down about the whole thing. I'm worried long term for United, we're not attracting top players and this won't help. Damn, I didn't want to lose my World Cup buzz before the final!

― David A. (Davant), Saturday, 8 July 2006 22:56 (eighteen years ago) link

World Cups always peter out a bit towards the anticlimactic end - it's kinda inherent within the structure and nature of the competition. I've enjoyed it as much if not more than any previous one I was around to see though. It helped being able to go out to a game and sample the atmos in the host country this time of course.

Predicting 2-1 to Italy tomorrow, with another very late and possibly controversial winner.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Saturday, 8 July 2006 23:09 (eighteen years ago) link

12 hours to go. I'm figuring it will be a bit anticlimatic as well but still I hope. I will be watching it here with some friends:

http://www.aussie-pub.com/

You do what you have to when you're in OC.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 9 July 2006 04:54 (eighteen years ago) link

get behind Italy down on Commercial Drive in Vancouver

Lucky bastard, are you going somewhere like Caffe Calabria?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 9 July 2006 04:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Maybe. Meeting friends at Abruzzo's early and seeing where we can get a seat. The Portuguese Club will probably be quiet! It's going to be a-hoppin', though, so there is a Plan B!

― David A. (Davant), Sunday, 9 July 2006 05:07 (eighteen years ago) link

It's a bit hard for United to shelter him when he's based at the Portuguese hotel, and all the hacks are out in Germany. It's probably the one time in the football calendar that United can't commandeer headlines in pursuit of their current agenda.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 10:45 (eighteen years ago) link

World Cups always peter out a bit towards the anticlimactic end

I'm not sure about this, the 1982, 1986 en 1998 finals were pretty exciting stuff. I thought this WC was bobbins (4-5-1 has to go, now!), but it got quite good during the knock-out phase, and Italy - Germany was a bit special (that and Mexico -Argentina are the only games I won't forget).

As for C. R*n*ld*, somehow I don't see him going to Real, he just isn't Capello's type of player (he probably is going to suck dry Juve and Milan after today.) Actually Real should have gotten Joaquin ages ago.

― Omar (Omar), Sunday, 9 July 2006 12:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Seeing how crap Ricardo dealt with long shots yesterday, it was a pity we didn't have any midfielders who are good at advancing from about 40 yards and shooting with power and accuracy.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 15:06 (eighteen years ago) link

I had an out of the blue prediction Friday night at 9:42 pm that Italy would win.

― Lenny Koggins (Bimble...), Sunday, 9 July 2006 15:10 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm off to Frith Street. See you after we've become champions/Gilardino misses the final penalty/Totti gets sent off for stabbing the ref (delete as applicable).

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 15:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh wow, what a penalty.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:07 (eighteen years ago) link

You spawny get, Zizou!

― Si.C@rter (SiC@rter), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Never a penalty - reminds me of the one Michael Owen got in 1998 - run between two defenders, then go down.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Johan Cruyff, he say 'beware scoring early penalties in World Cup finals in Germany'

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh well, Italy can hardly complain about dodgy penalties now can they?

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:14 (eighteen years ago) link

I thought he was nudged. Penalty.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Materazi, sinner to saint. Game on.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Woo-hoo!!!

― Lara (Lara), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:19 (eighteen years ago) link

he's made up for it there!

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:19 (eighteen years ago) link

After going through predictions for every match in this World Cup, I am currently 4th in a pool of a few hundred people and win the lot if Italy win. COME ON!!

― Lara (Lara), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:20 (eighteen years ago) link

Enough of this phoney war. The real battle- ITV vs BBC. Who's winning?

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:21 (eighteen years ago) link

He's got good tatts Materazi

― dr lulu (dr lulu), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Nice one DB - I reckon BBC right now but I'll switch for a few minutes and let you know. I also have Irish coverage to contend with...

― Lara (Lara), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:25 (eighteen years ago) link

I've switched to ITV; Motson is so fucking irritating. Retire him now.

Doing the wave should be an expulsion offence. It's the World Cup Final FFS.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:42 (eighteen years ago) link

Wahay. Crowd singing Marsellaise. It's like Escape to Victory.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy look composed - France's tactic is Erikssoneqsue - give it to the guy who can play a bit and hope for the best.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Well ITV have just fucked up with a "And at half time it's France nil, Italy nil"

― Lara (Lara), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Back to BBC for the half-time.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:49 (eighteen years ago) link

'in a sense, the score is nil-nil... from a certain point of view...'

― Jimmy Mod: NOIZE BOARD GRIL COMPARISON ANALYST (The Famous Jimmy Mod), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:50 (eighteen years ago) link

BBC have to win in terms of the half time commentary - for securing Martin O'Neill alone. But why oh why is shearer still on the panel?

― Lara (Lara), Sunday, 9 July 2006 17:55 (eighteen years ago) link

I can't see france scoring so they're going to have to try change things and bring another striker on to play with Henry.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 18:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm liking this so far. It was just about a penalty. I don't think I've ever chosen to watch a match on ITV when it's being shown on BBC.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Sunday, 9 July 2006 18:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Christ, Italy look shocking at the minute...

― Lara (Lara), Sunday, 9 July 2006 18:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Mark my words, if the French squad can pull a hammy, they have a good shout of clearing. It's all a matter of working short corners, palming away the opponent. Zidane needs to get on the end of some runs, play a high line, and that Mexican Wave will pull back. When Buffon stands up, works an inch of space on his right foot, and opts for the dink, it's in the bag. Route one from the great man.

― Momus (Momus), Sunday, 9 July 2006 18:32 (eighteen years ago) link

France have been much better this half. Because they've been attacking more they haven't conceded as many free kicks in dangerous position in the 2nd half. It's anybodys game at the moment, very even.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 18:36 (eighteen years ago) link

momus are you angling for a job swap with alan shearer by any chance?

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Sunday, 9 July 2006 18:53 (eighteen years ago) link

France shaded it over 90 minutes. Course, that means nothing now.

― Toad Roundgrin (noodle vague), Sunday, 9 July 2006 18:53 (eighteen years ago) link

Commentators, please shut the fuck up about Zidane's "injury"!

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, commentators, please stop saying that EVERY substitute is famous for scoring late game-winning goals.

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy look knackered, if they're gonna do this it'll have to be in open play.

― Toad Roundgrin (noodle vague), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:12 (eighteen years ago) link

wow @ zidane chestbutt!!

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:17 (eighteen years ago) link

un fucking believable. what a way to end your career.

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:18 (eighteen years ago) link

how odd

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:19 (eighteen years ago) link

What a way to end your career.

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:19 (eighteen years ago) link

jin(x)post

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:19 (eighteen years ago) link

haha materazzi must've said something good!

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:20 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane = thug???

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:21 (eighteen years ago) link

ZZ had to go. But clearly the italian said something so why wasnt he punished? I'd love to know what was said and if any of the officials actually saw it. It must have been the 4th official who gave the decision.
I hope this goes to penalties.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:21 (eighteen years ago) link

I reckon he's called him a bastard; that's what sent Cantona over the edge at Selhurst Park, and apparently, for someone from Marseille, there's nothing worse to say to them.

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane HeadButt downwards into the Chest, like a Bull at Pamplona

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:23 (eighteen years ago) link

I have a feeling if France pulls off the win it's going to feel sour. The crowd seems to be against them now.

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:24 (eighteen years ago) link

I'd be willing to bet that none of the officials actually saw it at the time -- if they broadcast that on the big screen, it would've been impossible to miss. Somehow that seems unfair, too.

ZZ will never live this down if France loses this.

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:24 (eighteen years ago) link

You'd think Zidane would have heard it all. It's hard to imagine a veteran losing his head over words.

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:25 (eighteen years ago) link

"'poirot' will follow the football"

― gooblar (gooblar), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:25 (eighteen years ago) link

US commentators said they showed the replay on the big screen a minute or two after it happened.

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:26 (eighteen years ago) link

I wish Zidane would go and headbutt Marcelo Balboa into a lifeless pulp. Those watching the moronic ABC commentary in the US can surely sympathize.

― adam (adam), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:26 (eighteen years ago) link

to be fair zz mustve been dying for a fag by that point, it was only a matter of time b4 he snapped

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:27 (eighteen years ago) link

Theres no doubt it was a reaction to what was said. ZZ cannot be defended in anyway for his reaction, but Materazzi goes unpunished.
France have been by far the better team in extra time. Italy have played for penalties since the hour mark.

I just hope theres no fight at full time/end of penalties.

I wonder if Lippi's protests got the 4th official to make a decision or if he knew the official seen it but the ref hadnt noticed.

Well its sure not been a dull final.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:28 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost - You could play drinking games with a lot of the us commentators phrases, "head full of steam," "fresh legs," "he's such an exciting playmaker," etc

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:30 (eighteen years ago) link

That was far beyond the pale, but, as others have said, he was OBV. provoked. The replay show them woofing at each other, but then Zidane ran ahead to play further, only to be baited back by whatever Materazzi said. I hope there is further clarification on what actually fucking happened.

― Big Loud Ape Mountain (Big Loud Mountain Ape), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:31 (eighteen years ago) link

It's wrong if he's been sent off because of a video replay, but yeah how unprofessional. Why should Materazzi be punished? I don't think there's a law about sledging.

― Toad Roundgrin (noodle vague), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:31 (eighteen years ago) link

The US TV station can't wait to rush to the golf tournament after the game is over.

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Fantastic headbutt from Zizou. Did Materazzi twist his nipples beforehand? Anyway - extraordinary negativity from Italy. A one man advantage deep into extra time with virtually all of France's attacking force off the pitch, but the Italians decide to keep it tight at the back and wait for penalties.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link

yes there is. Its called ungentlemanly conduct.

x-post

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:33 (eighteen years ago) link

If no one heard what Materazzi said, then how can you punish him? And how do you determine if the words warrant a card?

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy, 4-3 in penalties. Calling it now.

― Big Loud Ape Mountain (Big Loud Mountain Ape), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:34 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy really do NOT deserve to win this. Maybe they would if ZZ hadn't been sent off. But he's off and theres no sense of italian injustice.
I just wish we knew what materazzi said.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:34 (eighteen years ago) link

I'd like to see one of the goalies be stupidly gutsy and charge the shooter one of these shots.

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:36 (eighteen years ago) link

I hope De Rossi takes one and misses.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:36 (eighteen years ago) link

Cannevaro has been a badass all game, though.

― Big Loud Ape Mountain (Big Loud Mountain Ape), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:37 (eighteen years ago) link

What difference does it matter what Materazzi said? If it was a racial comment, then it would be significant.

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:37 (eighteen years ago) link

But otherwise, what difference does it make?

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:38 (eighteen years ago) link

I wonder if the ref will have the guts to make someone retake after the keeper moved and saves. None of them have stayed on the line.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, really. That's almost as bad as some of the Vinnie Jones stuff. A full-on headbutt to the chest DURING THE SECOND OVERTIME of the WORLD CUP FINAL!!!!!

Crap way to go.

― Big Loud Ape Mountain (Big Loud Mountain Ape), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:40 (eighteen years ago) link

All comes down to this shot!

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh man what a legacy Zidane leaves with.

― Michael F Gill (Michael F Gill), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:42 (eighteen years ago) link

right, good, it all seems to be over. can normal service be resumed now?

― grimly fiendish, hatin' football since 1981 (grimlord), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:42 (eighteen years ago) link

Ah well. Congrats, Italy. My cousin's family (in Calabria) has got to be going APESHIT right now.

― Big Loud Ape Mountain (Big Loud Mountain Ape), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:42 (eighteen years ago) link

Meh.

― Jimmy Mod: NOIZE BOARD GRIL COMPARISON ANALYST (The Famous Jimmy Mod), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane did a Rooney and cost his country the world cup with a piece of thuggery.
Will he ever be forgiven?
How many of these players will be going to new clubs after their clubs are relegated for corruption?

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:45 (eighteen years ago) link

One of the reasons football is so intense is because sometimes, you win when you don't deserve it. I feel sorry for France but they couldn't find a winner: them's the breaks.

Kerr, I thought you'd say ungentlemanly conduct but I dunno if I've heard of it being given simply for verbals. You'd think a guy like Zidane, of all people, would've kept his head.

― Toad Roundgrin (noodle vague), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidanes always been a bit of a hotheaded "nutter" now he's one literally.
World Cups been a bit of a letdown hasn't it? Most of the so called best teams have been shite.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane did a Rooney and cost his country the world cup with a piece of thuggery.

No, he didn't. It's not like he got sent off after 5 minutes and then Italy battered 10-man France 4-0. He got sent off right near the end of extra time, and Italy did absolutely nothing between then and the end of the match.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:49 (eighteen years ago) link

god that was an amazing headbutt!! I'm a bit in shock really.

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:49 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.fifa.com/en/laws/Laws12_04.htm

A player, substitute or substituted player is sent off and shown the red card if he commits any of the following seven offences:

1. is guilty of serious foul play
2. is guilty of violent conduct
3. spits at an opponent or any other person
4. denies the opposing team a goal or an obvious goalscoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (this does not apply to a goalkeeper within his own penalty area)
5. denies an obvious goalscoring opportunity to an opponent moving towards the player’s goal by an offence punishable by a free kick or a penalty kick
6. uses offensive or insulting or abusive language and/or gestures
7. receives a second caution in the same match.

― caek (caek), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Did Materazzi call him a Long Legged Alegerian-French Arab Camel?

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:51 (eighteen years ago) link

It's been won by a bunch of third division players, amazing!

― StanM (StanM), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:51 (eighteen years ago) link

saying that zidane cost france the cup seems unfair to me. there wasnt much to suggest it wouldnt have gone to pens with him on the pitch; he probably would have scored in the shootout but trezeguet was always going to take one, too.

xpost w/ hobb

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:52 (eighteen years ago) link

It just makes me sick to see De Rossi being allowed to play in the final after what he did. He should've got a huge ban like Leonardo did in 1990.

Can't do anything to ZZ now he's retired. A fine is nothing to him.
I suppose losing the shoot out is his punishment.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:52 (eighteen years ago) link

Ah well, I reckon Toni was onside from that free kick anyway.

― Toad Roundgrin (noodle vague), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:53 (eighteen years ago) link

You think the french will see it that way? (Unless they do what the English do and blame another player instead of the thug sent off for violent conduct)

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Congrats to Dom btw. I don't think he will be caring about any of this.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link

I've watched it again and confirmed my suspicions: Materazzi twisted Zidane's left nipple.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link

He did? I didn't see that. Doesn't excuse ZZ but that makes a huge difference since he was one of the penalty scorers.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 19:59 (eighteen years ago) link

ugh never mind the diving or refereeing or mafia cash or matchfixing

blaring stadium music really is the number one enemy of football

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:00 (eighteen years ago) link

congratulations to italy and all their supporters!

― ken c (ken c), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:01 (eighteen years ago) link

(apart from De Rossi and Materazzi?)

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:02 (eighteen years ago) link

oh boo hoo get over materazzi, it happens in every game ever played

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:04 (eighteen years ago) link

blaring stadium music really is the number one enemy of football

OTM. Go West? Almost as bad as Bolton celebrating every goal with 'I Feel Good...'.

congratulations to italy and all their supporters!

Yup. Not great tonight after the first half, but great penalties.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:04 (eighteen years ago) link

haha i had bolton in mind too!!

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:06 (eighteen years ago) link

i wonder how long until they start playing a bit of jaunty organ in the middle of the match like in basketball

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy took great penalties.

― Brigadier Lethbridge-Pfunkboy (Kerr), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy's celebrations were both graceless and buffoonish. I request, nay DEMAND, the award of the Global Soccer Trophy to bronze-medallist nation Germany. It's the only sane and RATIONAL response to such lollygagging horseplay.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:10 (eighteen years ago) link

I thought Italy's celebrations were very entertaining.

― theantmustdance (theantmustdance), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:14 (eighteen years ago) link

otm!

― ferzaffe (flezaffe), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:14 (eighteen years ago) link

I'll be interested to see whether the story tomorrow (in everywhere except Italy) will be "Italy wins World Cup" or "France loses; Zidane goes into history with a headbutt."

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Great match tarnished slightly by the unbelievable weirdness of Zidane's headbutt. Sad that will be as much a part of his legacy as his amazing play.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:15 (eighteen years ago) link

i could have done without pirlo draped around cannavaro for the entirety of the pens

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:15 (eighteen years ago) link

pleased for grosso to have got the clincher

― -- (688), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:17 (eighteen years ago) link

The fing abaht the World Cup is, it's all abaht ve kiddies, innit?

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:18 (eighteen years ago) link

Tomorrow it's Judgement Day for Juventus, AC Milan, Lazio, Fiorentina

The vultures of Spain and England are circulating

man utd want gattuso and pirlo

toni - will he be a target for a premiership club such as Newcastle ?

if Juventus, AC Milan, Lazio, Fiorentina get kicked out of Serie A
will Lecce, Messina, Treviso - who were relegated from Serie A to Serie B - stay up? plus the losers of the serie b play off final [ Mantova] - get promoted

3 confirmed promoted clubs to Serie A are: Atalanta, Catania, Torino, surely they can't promote another 4 clubs from Serie B, it would be more logical to follow my scenario above instead ?

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:18 (eighteen years ago) link

DJM OTMFM.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:20 (eighteen years ago) link

look lets be honest - zidane's moment will live way longer that anything else we saw tonight. you will talk about it forever, you will say "ooh ooh calm down zidane" when someone gets riled in your old ppl's home kickabout in 2056, you fucking love it dont you

ok well i do

― rtccc (mwah), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:20 (eighteen years ago) link

That was great. Awesome headbutt. Was Materezzi taunting ZZ about never having played for Everton? You;d have thought he'd be used to getting called 'baldy'.

Loved lenart johansen confiscating the World Cup cos Italians were drooling all over it. Well done Italia.

― Pete W (peterw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:23 (eighteen years ago) link

It will be the defining moment of our generation.

― Pete W (peterw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:24 (eighteen years ago) link

Johansson confiscating the trophy? I hope so - a return to MANNERS and COURTESY.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link

I wish Zidane would go and headbutt Marcelo Balboa into a lifeless pulp. Those watching the moronic ABC commentary in the US can surely sympathize.

Oh, I hear you.

Great time watching it, definitely a better final than I was expecting but god I hate any game going to penalties. And that headbutt...we were all pretty stunned!

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:29 (eighteen years ago) link

Car horn bedlam in Waterloo!

― Pete W (peterw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link

ZZ for player of the tournament, innit? (announced tomorrow?)

― xyzzzz__ (jdesouza), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:31 (eighteen years ago) link

LOLZ

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link

Where are ILXOR Anglo-Italians: boy in corduroy and Dom

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:34 (eighteen years ago) link

"i wonder how long until they start playing a bit of jaunty organ in the middle of the match like in basketball

-- rtccc (giaou...) (webmail), July 9th, 2006 5:08 PM. (mwah) (later) (link)"

i think this has been the main thing i've discovered i love abt soccer this past month - NO PIPED-IN MUSIC OR AUDIO CUES. that stuff drives me aaaaaapeshit abt american sports. I don't wanna hear anything but the game and the crowd.

btw http://images.cainer.net//uploads/zidane.gif

― INSANE CLOWN FOSSE (Adrian Langston), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:36 (eighteen years ago) link

Can we have a sweepstake as to when Dom will eventually come down to earth and post on this thread. I bags 0115-0130 BST.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Congats to Dom!

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Definitely a dive.

― Pete W (peterw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:40 (eighteen years ago) link

party at the bus stop outside my house
http://lolrider.com/newpix/IMG_2110.JPG

― ken c (ken c), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:44 (eighteen years ago) link

http://lolrider.com/newpix/IMG_2113.JPG

― ken c (ken c), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:44 (eighteen years ago) link

ten brave cockrels, one stupid cock

― weasel diesel (K1l14n), Sunday, 9 July 2006 20:45 (eighteen years ago) link

"Where are ILXOR Anglo-Italians: boy in corduroy and Dom"

where would you be if your team had just won the world cup? drunk and mental in the streets/pub or on ilx? oh wait...

italy were terrible the way they were gooning about at the end, grosso and materazzi in particular (esp. materazzi). but, WELL DONE ITALY. i wanted them to win cos i backed them and also cos i just wanted them to.

― michael wells (michael w.), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy's low point in football was:

October 2002 Wales 2 Italy 1

Italy Team that Day: [amazing how Lippi has transformed the team/ squad since then]

Gianluigi Buffon 1
Fabio Cannavaro 5
Alessandro Nesta 13
Christian Panucci 2 [NOT in WC 2006]
Massimo Ambrosini 16 [NOT in WC 2006]
Luigi Di Biagio 14 [NOT in WC 2006]
Andrea Pirlo
Damiano Tommasi 17 [NOT in WC 2006]
Luciano Zauri [NOT in WC 2006]
Alessandro Del Piero 7
Vincenzo Montella 20 [NOT in WC 2006]

subs: Abbiati, Adani, Iuliano, Oddo, Gattuso, Maccarone, Marazzina.
[Only Oddo AND Gattuso in WC 2006]

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:06 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm v pleased Italy won tho it was predictably unpretty. Game often good tho. Zidane is a silly man. I do feel for rubbish Trezeguet a bit tho, himself the hero in 2000.

I think the French/Zidane fans will certainly forgive ZZ for his moment of madness tonight considering how few of them must've expected France to get this far - and him being so instrumental in that.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:11 (eighteen years ago) link

What a bummer. Who is more to blame, ZZ or Trezeguet?

I am almost too deflated to note that the Italian players had nice sideburns.

― Mary (Mary), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:18 (eighteen years ago) link

France were obviously the better team but if you look at the entire tournament Italy have nothing to apologize for. Great performance throughout it all.

Tomorrow will be great too because Juve will get relegated and then Milan will most likely sign Zambrotta and Buffon as soon as possible.

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:27 (eighteen years ago) link

yeah, the italians had better hair.

― geeta (geeta), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:28 (eighteen years ago) link

The Italian players did have a certain sense of style. In a 1978 kind of way.

The person most pleased by Zidane's (already famous) headbutt will probably be Le Pen.

― paulhw (paulhw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:29 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm already writing my ethics paper on it haha

― poortheatre (poortheatre), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:34 (eighteen years ago) link

― Dave B (daveb), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:42 (eighteen years ago) link

That's clearly a dive.

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Who is more to blame, ZZ or Trezeguet?

I was talking about this with my father. Note that neither keeper saved a single shot. Treguzet was off-target. So, strictly speaking, I would say that he "lost" the Cup, rather than the Italians winning it per se.

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Were France really that better on the night? Italy sat back a bit and invited pressure but actually had the better chances (narrow offside, header off crossbar). Once again Henry lacked support and usually when France went down the wing to cross in there were six Italians in the box waiting. Terrific save from Buffon late on tho.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Man on Radio 5 said ZZ was doing the "dignified" thing when he lashed out because he had "obviously" been racially abused because "all these Italians are racists".

Hmmm....

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:50 (eighteen years ago) link

french television is apparently reporting that the italian said something about ZZ's mama

― poortheatre (poortheatre), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:53 (eighteen years ago) link

And who'd win a head-butting contest between Zidane and Basil Bolie?

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:54 (eighteen years ago) link

I was already excitedly babbling that this was the best final since 86 before Zidane's moment of hugely entertaining madness. Somebody please take every photograph of anything ever and photoshop in Zizou headbutting it, pls.

Also: Italy's penalties were almost uniformly excellent, the disallowed goal looked onside to me but was the chap at the near post interfering blah blah blah, Fabio Cannavaro really is an absolute fucking badass isn't he?

Congratulations to Dom "Dom Passantino" Passantino and all his compatriots.

― Mauro Samurainesi (Ferg), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Best bit of tonight - one lone dude from the Italian restaurant in town cycling about after the match on a bike with the Roman centurion waxwork from his restaurant in the front basket (cycling dude was in an Italy shirt and wearing a straw boater). I have a photo, but haven't downloaded it yet.

I'd been wanting France to win because I wuv Zizou, and have been telling people this all week. I feel he's let me down, and I tried to switch allegiance to Italy as a result, but I couldn't.

Conversation in pub tonight (just before he got carded, when we thought it he was getting away with it):

Bloke at bar: "that'll get caught on video, he'll get a suspension"
Me: "what, from all those international games he's playing AFTER HE'S RETIRED"
Bloke at bar: "oh yeah"
Me: "he should declare himself unretired from the games against Scotland in the qualifiers and get suspended for them"
Bloke at bar: "hahaha, yeah"
Me: (thinks) *people are stupid*

― ailsa (ailsa), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Mentalism watching the game at Bar Kick on Shoreditch High Street. The entire bar was full of French fans bar a tiny enclave of Italians round our corner. It was, frankly, insane.

Italy have won the World Cup. On penalties. What the fuck is that all about?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Sunday, 9 July 2006 21:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Erm, the world cup. on penalites. *struggles with the rhetorical question*

― paulhw (paulhw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Me: (thinks) *people are stupid*

Where I was watching there was this crazy rambling dude who was cheering for Italy throughout the entire game, then Zidane headbutted Materazzi and he started yelling "good, the Italians take dives all the time and they deserve to get hurt." He rooted for France for the remainder of the match.

― NoTimeBeforeTime (Barry Bruner), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:06 (eighteen years ago) link

a person on the football365 forum says that he has a friend who lives in france that claims that "the latest news" is that materazzi said "play for your own country"...

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:09 (eighteen years ago) link

I tried to explain to Neil tonight about Dom being in Bar Italia watching, and how cool that would be (note: we are Scottish, we know nothing about how great this could even possibly be)

I wish I still had Mark's number. I texted former-Italy-resident-with-half-Italian-boyf Madchen and got no response, I hope she's having fun.

Zinedane Zidane is still making me want to cry.

trezeguet was always going to take one, too.

Even if ZZ, Henry and Vieira had stayed on till the end?

― ailsa (ailsa), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh man. Oh man oh man oh man. Frith Street again, obviously, but then after the match a crowd of Italians the likes we haven't seen since the last Eritrean military victory marched on Picadilly Circus and flag waving and horn tooting and climbing up lampposts to wave the tricolore and couples were making out and and and yes.

Look, this is the thing, all that bullshit in the Guardian with the fucking "Yes, the world cup is very entertaining if you like that kind of thing BUT WHAT ABOUT TEH POLITICAL STRUGGLEZ?" is bullshit. This world cup win means so much fucking more than anything else in my life to date. I've always been proud of being Italian, and now, finally, I can have pride in something Italy has done. We're a poor fucking country, you know that? My dad's from Sicily, the life expectancy there is what you'd expect to find Ghana or Nigeria or something. The infant mortality is something like 20 in 1000. I mean, we're gutter, we're dirt. Italy's a country riddled with corruption and criminality, from bottom to top. It's a fucked up place. But now... new prime minister. New president. The head lopped from the top of the Mafia. They're finally building a bridge between Sicily and the mainland (fun fact: if an AC Palermo supporter wishes to drive from his home ground to watch Palermo play Juventus, he'd need to leave his house at 5pm Saturday). And now this. This is it. This is a fucking corner being turned here.

Ah, man, fuck, forget all that. Grosso is a pimp. Cannavaro is immense. Pirlo was godly out there. Gattuso I am totally gay for. Del Piero didn't fuck up for once! What kinda fucking bizarro universe is this when Del piero doesn't fuck the hell up in a major match?

Just so so so crushingly intense, it really is, it beats any other feeling in my life by so far. Man... we did it. We fucking did it.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, the political boost it gives Prodi for being in charge of the country at the time of a world cup victory = Berlusconi's political career is now dead!

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:12 (eighteen years ago) link

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41867000/jpg/_41867246_canna1cup300.jpg

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:14 (eighteen years ago) link

Congrats Dom!

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:16 (eighteen years ago) link

/me *hugs* Dom

― ailsa (ailsa), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:18 (eighteen years ago) link

Here, have some uber-patriotic gay eurotechno/1960s guinea rock n roll crossover. A list of great Italians, set to a pumping shirt off beat, sung on by Little Tony, a kind of less credibily Johnny Halliday.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=8HCvU0TxfS0&search=pitagora%20figli

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:21 (eighteen years ago) link

nice one dom, i'm happy for you. it's just a pity materazzi had to win too.

― michael wells (michael w.), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Hey all,

Holy crap that was hard work! I spent the last 15 minutes of the game shaking and about to burst into torrents of tears (happy or sad, didn't matter). I have no doubt Materazzi said something absolutely foul to Zidane and I expect a debate about it to overshadow the actual result over the next couple of days. But, just like Lucas Neill, the fault lay absolutely with Zidane and he, and the rest of France, can't consider anyone else to blame for his expulsion.

I thought the French goal was a penalty - I am convinced that Materazzi intentionally kicked out just a teensy bit at the key moment, so no complaints there. I also think the Toni disallowed goal was correctly disallowed. The refereeing was excellent throughout.

Congratulations to Lara and all her supporters.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:24 (eighteen years ago) link

Hmm. In the heat of the moment we say things...(I don't know Dom, and I don't want to be needlessly mean) but popular entertainment and sport is a funny thing. It produces feelings that are very real, but are misleading...

This is a fucking corner being turned here.

C'mon, remember the West Indies cricket team? The Atlanta braves? Corners weren't turned. Dead ends got worse.

This world cup win means so much fucking more than anything else in my life to date.

Oh boy. Re-read anytime soon.

― paulhw (paulhw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:37 (eighteen years ago) link

You have to remember Italy's heart beats with football, that's what everything else in the country (politics, religion, the economy) revolves around.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Anytime soon means that something else will have overtaken it. have you NEVER had a feeling in your life that of "this is the best thing EVER"?

― ailsa (ailsa), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Dom finish this sequence:

International Football, Country: Italy
English Football Club: Northampton Town
Italian Football Club: What club does Dom follow?

― DJ Martian (djmartian), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:45 (eighteen years ago) link

x-post. As I re-read what I wrote, I realized it came across as dumb and cold. Yeah, I know the *best time ever* feeling. (Hanging up on the phone after getting a date with a girl / dancing for hours in a club / acceptance of marriage proposal etc). And for a lot of people, I can imagine something like this would be equally great.

So (ahem), Dom: congratulations! (And I also like your music writing).

― paulhw (paulhw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:46 (eighteen years ago) link

ITALY WINS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;)

Zidane's red card: despicable!

Oh sorry - I didn't know grimly fiendish had been hating football since 1981.

― Lenny Koggins (Bimble...), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:47 (eighteen years ago) link

this is interesting

― RJG (RJG), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Congrats to Dom and Mark and other Italy supporters! If it wasn't "deserved" (through trying to play "positively" etc) in the final per se, it was certainly so seeing the tournament as a whole, I think.

We were trying to guess what Materazzi could have said to make ZZ react like that, and never got closer than "**** *** you **** ** mother ******** *** ****** Arabian **** ***** cunt!!!", but what Lovelace's sources allege ("Play for your own country") is worse in every way, in far fewer words.

Anyone know what was said by Christian Poulsen to Totti before the Spitting Incident in 2004, btw?

― The Vintner's Lipogram (OleM), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:49 (eighteen years ago) link

DJ Martian: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Citt%C3%A0_di_Palermo

You may note, home of Grosso.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Do you think "Play for your own country" is only the kind of thing conjured up by others when considering the worst you could say? I mean, we all saw the footage, and it's pretty hard to lip-read from there.
Besides that, Zidane is absolutely international. He is hardly a dyed-in-the-wool Frenchman, and by now and after several world cups, it's hard to imagine that he would take nationalist taunts that seriously.

― paulhw (paulhw), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:53 (eighteen years ago) link

I think Poulsen said something about his momma, if memory serves. Some British news sources are reporting that Materazzi's crime was to pinch Zidane's nipples. That would somehow make Zizou's red card even funnier.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 22:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes I keep hearing all this speculation about what that other player might have said to him. "I fucked your wife last night" was one explanation I overheard.

― Lenny Koggins (Bimble...), Sunday, 9 July 2006 23:01 (eighteen years ago) link

I have no interest in cricket whatsoever, so if someone else can fill in the details that would be great, but it brings to mind this awesome exchange:

Possibly English batsman: (x), why are you so fucking fat?
Almost definitely West Indian bowler: Because every time I fuck your wife she gives me a biscuit.

Fantastic.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Sunday, 9 July 2006 23:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Dunno paulhw, a LOT has been made at least as far back as the 1998 WC of how the (some/many/most?) French saw footballing success as a symbol of the success of integration etc. Note how the Italian squad is ahem "ethnically homogenous" to quite another degree.

(Hasn't this for centuries been a bit of difference btwn France and eg Germany and Italy? Ie, to oversimplify, "if you feel French you ARE French"? Actual French people to thread now plz to tell me if I am being idiot.)

― The Vintner's Lipogram (OleM), Sunday, 9 July 2006 23:03 (eighteen years ago) link

what he said was "yer maw's got baws and yer da luvs it"

― ken c (ken c), Sunday, 9 July 2006 23:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane is a bit crazy, isn't he? I've seen him headbutt opponents before and we all remember when he stomped on that Saudi player in the 98 World Cup.

"French saw footballing success as a symbol of the success of integration etc."

They saw it as such but it amounted to nothing real or concrete. Look at the situation today.

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Sunday, 9 July 2006 23:33 (eighteen years ago) link

i just realised that i now don't mind lawro, he works better as a co-commentator than as an "expert" as he is on motd. i enjoy his camp bitchiness and he also called out motty over his perotta/ashton-under-lyne factoid: "is that all you know about him?".

― michael wells (michael w.), Sunday, 9 July 2006 23:45 (eighteen years ago) link

We're a poor fucking country, you know that? My dad's from Sicily, the life expectancy there is what you'd expect to find Ghana or Nigeria or something. The infant mortality is something like 20 in 1000.

Maybe I'm taking your post too seriously, but Italy is a poor country by nobody's standards. It's actually a very rich country. And the life expectancy in Sicily is 76 for men. It's 56 in Ghana and 46 in Nigeria.

― Super Cub (Debito), Sunday, 9 July 2006 23:57 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh, and the infant mortality rate is 5.7 in 1000. It's 73 in Nigeria. Ok, I'm done now.

― Super Cub (Debito), Monday, 10 July 2006 00:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane was awesome!

― The Ultimate Conclusion (lokar), Monday, 10 July 2006 00:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah. It's sad to see him go like this, but he's still the best player of the last, what, 15 years?

http://img-actu.x-echo.com/Images/mmd--francais--journal_internet--une/SGE.OXK07.090706212631.photo03.photo.default-405x512.jpg

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 00:52 (eighteen years ago) link

ZZ regrets it, Domenech says in Time.

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 01:24 (eighteen years ago) link

Materazzi refused to divulge what he said exactly, it says here.

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 01:26 (eighteen years ago) link

Well at least Germany coach Jurgen Klinsmann has won something - he's been voted the best-dressed coach at the World Cup with Spain's Luis Aragones the worst. (Daily Star)

He dresses like a choirboy, which is always a good move.

― Mary (Mary), Monday, 10 July 2006 01:53 (eighteen years ago) link

that Time article is so hilariously biased it's kind of thrilling!

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 10 July 2006 02:10 (eighteen years ago) link

it really is! and why are seemingly random words bolded like that?

― s1ocki (slutsky), Monday, 10 July 2006 03:06 (eighteen years ago) link

they're the vocab words!

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 10 July 2006 04:48 (eighteen years ago) link

I discovered, at about 3am, that some Italians live a couple of doors down from me. They arrived in convoy, leaning out of sunroofs, horns tooting, champagne bottle aloft.

Our next-door neighbour stood outside and applauded them, then got a bit grumpy when they tried to continue the party in their front garden.

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Monday, 10 July 2006 06:04 (eighteen years ago) link

I came home from YMOF's on a 38 bus full of 200 jumping, singing, flag-waving Italians. It took some forward planning to get off the bus at my stop.

― suzy (suzy), Monday, 10 July 2006 06:18 (eighteen years ago) link

I hate the way when one team loses everyone casts around to decide whose 'fault' it is. Ultimately two very evenly matched teams cancelled each other out, and Italy edged it by being marginally better at penalties. It's not Trezeguet's fault: his penalty was pretty good and very nearly bounced down over the line (like Zidane's earlier in the match), and besides you don't expect everyone to score (or in England's case you don't expect anyone to score). It's not Zidane's fault: what he did was crazy, but there was only about 10 minutes left of extra time and his sending off changed nothing at all (if anything France looked more likely to win it).

Also, I don't quite get the moral outrage at Zidane's headbutt. He got sent off, fair enough. He didn't hack someone down when they had a goalscoring opportunity, he didn't break someone's legs, he didn't headbutt someone in the face and smash their nose up. I doubt Materazzi is celebrating his World Cup win in hospital this morning with severe chest pains. Am I the only person who was quite impressed with the sheer power of the headbutt? (And I was cheering on both teams - I just wanted to see lots of goals - in the absence of goals, headbutts will do).

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 06:41 (eighteen years ago) link

What I'm trying to say is: people are talking as if Zidane hadn't headbutted Materazzi then France would have won the World Cup. It doesn't work like that - penalties are a lottery. Even supposing that Zidane took one instead of Trezeguet and it was 5-5 and went into sudden death I'd still favour Italy because Buffon is better than the pixie.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 06:43 (eighteen years ago) link

"people are talking as if Zidane hadn't headbutted Materazzi then France would have won the World Cup. It doesn't work like that"

That bit I agree with.

"penalties are a lottery."

That bit I don't.

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Monday, 10 July 2006 07:06 (eighteen years ago) link

http://wdwwa.biz/zidane/326a8f5ad4dc04ca9a5cd7e20e29f63f8654333a.gif

― INSANE CLOWN FOSSE (Adrian Langston), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:06 (eighteen years ago) link

Also on 38 bus: very annoyed Nigerian man in seat next to me, clucking disapprovingly at happy Italians, rambling on about how people shouldn't behave that way when they come to Britain to live or work. I just looked at him like he was the biggest fun-hater in the world: 'get real, this happens once every four years for one country of people, they are only happy - and do you realise you sound like the Daily Mail?' before I all'ora'd and scusi'd my way up the bus. Dom, what's the song that starts with Mamma?

― suzy (suzy), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:08 (eighteen years ago) link

bohemian rhapsody

― RJG (RJG), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:12 (eighteen years ago) link

haha! No, there was a particular football song the bus riders were doing in a repertoire of about four. Sadly I was too mashed to remeber even a bit of the melody or any of the Italian words after Mamma.

― suzy (suzy), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Fuck. Football is a bitch. That's the last time I watch the WC

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:21 (eighteen years ago) link

hahaha ade, that one is my favourite.

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:27 (eighteen years ago) link

Ha ha - Zidane's won the Golden Ball.

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:29 (eighteen years ago) link

That Time article was written in the author's semen on a Lionel Richie cast of Zidane's face.

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Is there any easy way of finding out which team got the most cards in the tournament?

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:48 (eighteen years ago) link

'mia'? the rest of it is english though.

xxxxxpost i'd guess portugal or holland

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:52 (eighteen years ago) link

Must be Portugal, mustn't it?

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:53 (eighteen years ago) link

You'd think so! But I don't want to put the ppl who picked them into my work prize draw and then find it wasn't.

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 10 July 2006 08:56 (eighteen years ago) link

I have no interest in cricket whatsoever, so if someone else can fill in the details that would be great, but it brings to mind this awesome exchange:

Possibly English batsman: (x), why are you so fucking fat?
Almost definitely West Indian bowler: Because every time I fuck your wife she gives me a biscuit.

Fantastic.

Corrections

The batsmans was the fat one, well he was a number 11 so a bowler really but he was batting at the time,

It was Zimbabwes Eddo Brandes and the bowler was Aussie Glenn Mcgrath

― Jarlr'mai (jarlrmai), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Tom:

http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com/06/en/w/stats/detail.html?section=tdc

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:06 (eighteen years ago) link

I heard that exact same story involving a British tourist and the guy that plays Harold Bishop in Neighbours.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:06 (eighteen years ago) link

france and germany committed the most fouls (given)

but portugal received more cards than any other team including 24 yellow cards

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes, cards was what I wanted - thanks Steve!

― Tom (Groke), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:16 (eighteen years ago) link

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j208/worldcupicons/leg.jpg

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Wedgie!

― suzy (suzy), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:31 (eighteen years ago) link

OK, that's replaced gangling Peter Crouch as Best Picture Ever.

― ailsa (ailsa), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I return to say:

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/4758/zidane6ki2cy.gif

― Hairy Asshurt (Toaster), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:34 (eighteen years ago) link

somebody stayed up all night to do that!

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:35 (eighteen years ago) link

I think it was bad and wrong of me to suggest this was an unpleasant final outcome. I don't like extra time and/or penalties, but on reflection, it was very much in keeping with the spirit of the tournament. AS for Zidane's "Biffa Bacon moment", I think it was quite good. In fact, it was the crowning glory of a World Cup that has been enlivened by blatant disregard for the rules and common decency.

Overall, I don't think I could ask much more of a tournament I really wasn't looking forward to at all.

I particularly enjoyed the company, when there was company. But sometimes I just enjoyed lying on the settee, semi-comatose, letting David Pleat's expert analysis wash over me like tiny waves lapping at a tropical lagoon's edge.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:43 (eighteen years ago) link

http://images5.theimagehosting.com/pisa.50e.gif

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:44 (eighteen years ago) link

pah!

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:45 (eighteen years ago) link

My sister watched the match with a hundred or so french villagers in a cowshed in Rieupeyroux, which is in France. She stopped texting me around penalty time. I have yet to find out whether there was some kind of riot.

Is there good footage which would enable a lip-reader to tell us what Materazzi said? If not, Zizou could just make it up, couldn't he?

The best bit of the match by far was the Samurai losing his topknot.

― Mädchen (Madchen), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:55 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.soosed.com/images/zidane-hammer.gif

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 09:57 (eighteen years ago) link

take 2:

http://images5.theimagehosting.com/pisa.50e.gif

― hella somethin' Gwen Stefani pantwork (haitch), Monday, 10 July 2006 10:01 (eighteen years ago) link

materazzi "I've recently discovered this band called coldplay. They're sooo dreamy and amaz..."
http://www.8erhoekers.nl/zidane.gif

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 10:07 (eighteen years ago) link

zoe zidane: don't try it

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Monday, 10 July 2006 10:13 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kx9iPFMriz0

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 10:16 (eighteen years ago) link

The best bit of the match by far was the Samurai losing his topknot.

I missed that due to my dad phoning and me having to go outside in search of better reception. Came back into pub to find Neil hooting with laughter.

― ailsa (ailsa), Monday, 10 July 2006 10:35 (eighteen years ago) link

"Zoe Zidane"

Actually she's called Lila. Though Zoe would be much funnier.

― Hello Sunshine (Hello Sunshine), Monday, 10 July 2006 10:40 (eighteen years ago) link

I have handed over the sweepstake money!

I cried and cried and cried, like C. Ronaldo watching Bambi.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh, and Materazzi has the word "lion" and his date of birth in roman numerals (do they still use them there?) tattooed on his arm, apparently. It says in The Guardian.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:11 (eighteen years ago) link

alternative heading: MC finally gets his revenge on Petridish.

― Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:12 (eighteen years ago) link

Blimey - we did look him up to check on his Domenech-nemesis credentials as a Leo and there we are: it's written all over him. We were hoping it was a "Moysey, come and get me" message.

His goals in this WC were Mountfield-like, so he clearly didn't bunk off every lesson at the School of Science.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:22 (eighteen years ago) link

I feel like there's a bigger distance between us and Our Italian Brothers now, in that we no longer have being consistently shit at penalties and not having won anything for ages in common with them.

When you're dancing, and laughing, and finally living etc

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:37 (eighteen years ago) link

at least we'll still have all those finals that we reached.....

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:39 (eighteen years ago) link

It strikes me that the World Cup - and football championships generally - are very different from American sports in that everyone always remembers the loser as well. In the US, nobody does. If you don't win it all, by the next year people can barely remember the fact that you made it that far. In soccer it's always "Remember [x] - [y], 1992?" or whatnot, which is nice

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:42 (eighteen years ago) link

feel almost empty today.
i cried like a baby, last night, when grosso scored that final penalty.
and i was sincerely sorry for zidane, he really lost his head (but unfortunately it wasn't the first time).

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:43 (eighteen years ago) link

and when it's something like ice hockey or something people don't remember the headbutts prolly!

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:44 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost.. still, takes the heat off rooney a little bit perhaps

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:46 (eighteen years ago) link

feel almost empty today.

MasterCleansing with chianti will do that

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:46 (eighteen years ago) link

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v509/jobhosle/1e5b90df376ab8cd309658af8289e487.gif

― zappi (joni), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Is Domenech Catalan, as his name suggests?

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 12:53 (eighteen years ago) link

Haha, Zidane was pretty funny. He probably figured he didn't need another winners medal anyway and it would be better to take advantage of the fact that there's not much the authorities can do to reprimand him. Unless they ban him from his deckchair.

Italy deserved to win, given their performances throughout the tournament and their history of very bad luck indeed. Zidane is still the best player I've ever seen kick a football. Fin.

― Ally C (Ally C), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:11 (eighteen years ago) link

feel almost empty today.

Ah Marco, Stripey and I were thinking of you all during the match. :-)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Ally C OTM.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Raymond Domenech (born January 24, 1952 in Lyon) is a former French football player and the current manager of the French national team. He is of Catalan descent. His father fled Spain during the rule of Francisco Franco.

― Jerry the Nipper (Jerrynipper), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:17 (eighteen years ago) link

cookie, are you at home?

― RJG (RJG), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Now I'm singing the Cookie Monster song.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:20 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm at home, if that helps.

Fancy doing the quiz later?

― Alba (Alba), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:22 (eighteen years ago) link

what if amerika is right about the french

― dave q (listerine), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:23 (eighteen years ago) link

I am at home.

― Ally C (Ally C), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:38 (eighteen years ago) link

answer the telephone, please

― RJG (RJG), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes, you could say that Italy were the better side across the tournament - better in the group stage (France matched their last two results, but against inferior opposition), not as good in the first two knockout rounds (3-0 vs Ukraine was pretty clinical but didn't really compare with the glory of that victory over Brazil), vastly superior in the semi (which remains the pinnacle of the four weeks). And yet...France outplayed them for over an hour in the final.

I'm sure kids are charging rhino-like into each other across playgrounds all over Europe today. Ava's already given me a fat lip with a headbutt.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:40 (eighteen years ago) link

Excellent work, Jerry.

Excellent work, Ava.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:43 (eighteen years ago) link

Dudes, speaking as a person who has held on to a Juventis Zidane jersey for ages now for no good reason, if my final memory of seeing him play is the Matarazzi head butt, I can die truly happy. That shit was hysterical and really got applauded and cheered like crazy in the bar I was in (even by Italy supporters). Tom had on my Zidane jersey and fake headbutted a dude walking past in Materazzi's jersey and those dudes all kind of high fived each other then and claimed this as an "awesome" gesture? I'm kind of floored that anyone on this thread suggested he would be considered as costing France the cup or people would turn on him for it; it was far too funny and it is highly unlikely it affected the outcome. I am glad others have talked sense about this, and have posted amusing animated gifs.

Also congrats Italy! I still hate you but whatever!

― Allyzay will never stop making pancakes (allyzay), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Italy was waiting for the pen shoot-out since half-time. Depressing

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:45 (eighteen years ago) link

quiz is OK, I think. don't have my mobile, here

excellent work

― RJG (RJG), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:52 (eighteen years ago) link

"Italy was waiting for the pen shoot-out since half-time. Depressing"

Italians were on their knees after the first half but I don't remember France having so many occasions or playing particularly shining football - they had ball possession, played well but the match could go on forever and they would never scored (and I can tell you that, considering how many times we lost at the penalties, Italian team wasn't waiting at all for the shoot-out: they simply hadn't any more stamina).

ps ciao Ned!!!

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Monday, 10 July 2006 13:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Finally, some sense about the headbutt! Best .gif ever for the 6-hit super combo, too.

For all this talk about "the disgrace" and how he is forced to retire in shame and blah blah blah I'm just thinking about how there is now a trademark move called the ZIDANE which if anything, adds to the pinnacle of his brilliance.

*bosh*

Although I was thinking, as he was about to head the ball in that close chance in extra time that OH! it was going to be the fairytale ending. He still ended it all with his head, though. Arf etc.

― Suedey (John Cei Douglas), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:04 (eighteen years ago) link

"meritate tutti ciò, voi gli enculato di musulmani, sporchi
terroristici"
This is the latest rumour about what Mazeratti has really said (I don't think it needs any translation, does it ?

― snowballing (snowballing), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:06 (eighteen years ago) link

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41867000/jpg/_41867676_lippi270.jpg

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:16 (eighteen years ago) link

They're back in France, have been talking to the president.

http://s.tf1.fr/mmdia/i/00/8/2198008.jpg

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:17 (eighteen years ago) link

Back home as well:

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a118/rawiyaparand/football/eb1ec0f4.jpg

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:17 (eighteen years ago) link

http://pics.livejournal.com/mi3ch/pic/0015zb0q/s640x480.jpg

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:18 (eighteen years ago) link

something about marinading muesli?

xxxpost

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:18 (eighteen years ago) link

"meritate tutti ciò, voi gli enculato di musulmani, sporchi
terroristici"
This is the latest rumour about what Mazeratti has really said (I don't think it needs any translation, does it ?

translation in real Italian, maybe?

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:19 (eighteen years ago) link

haha that last pic!

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:20 (eighteen years ago) link

Is he headbutting Chirac?

"Comment tu as fait pour têtebutter cet Italien?"
"comme ci, ton excellence! *baoum*"

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:22 (eighteen years ago) link

finally!

http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/daniel_davies/2006/07/it_was_a_wonderful_headbutt.html

― Pete W (peterw), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:24 (eighteen years ago) link

That's dreadful grammar, even for a kid from Lecce :)

― Mädchen (Madchen), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:27 (eighteen years ago) link

"meritate tutti ciò, voi gli enculato di musulmani, sporchi
terroristici"
This is the latest rumour about what Mazeratti has really said (I don't think it needs any translation, does it ?

-- snowballing (snowballin...), July 10th, 2006.

"Mazeratti" is even better than the pidgin Italian phrase.

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Is Zidane really in disgrace? Will anyone in France actually blame him? More likely they'll continue to revere him as someone who won them a World Cup, a European Championships and pretty much singlehandedly got them to the final this time.

Also, if it does turn out to be a racist insult hurled, we'll be in a Cantona situation when everyone suddenly stops blaming him altogether.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Monday, 10 July 2006 14:47 (eighteen years ago) link

zidane will not be in disgrace, of course, but i disagree that he brought them to this final singlehandedly. indeed, i'd say thuram, gallas and makelele played a bigger part over the course of the tournament.

― weasel diesel (K1l14n), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Plenty of people continue(d) to blame Cantona.

"Look at all you lot, bunch of gay muslims, porking terrorists at every opportunity."

Is that near enough? Because I don't undertsand it, no.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Kilian - well yes, but there's a big difference between reality and public perception. I love Claude Makelele and although he's fantastic about what he does it rarely sticks in the mind and you never get those 'turning a game with one moment of genius' moments that people remember. Although am I right in thinking Makelele got forward a bit more in the World Cup than he does for Chelsea, or is it just my imagination?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:07 (eighteen years ago) link

I think the headbutt will take him to an even higher mythic level... more than a french hero, more than one of the greatest players ever... these pictures will be played again and again as much as some of his finest technical moves.
he's has become a genuis angry god now !

― AleXTC (AleXTC), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:09 (eighteen years ago) link

yeah, incidents like this can do wonders for your mystique. he chose the least appropriate time to have a violent fit of temper, it's lead to all sorts of "what is going on in the head of this troubled genius?"-type speculation, he's the man who blew it at the very top, rather than "fading superstar whose form has been patchy for a couple of years now, and had a patchy world cup with occasional moments of excellence!"

― weasel diesel (K1l14n), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:14 (eighteen years ago) link

He's like Sean Penn, only not a prick.

― Pete W (peterw), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Well, it certainly seems to have overshadowed the World Cup. I think that's kind of a shame.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:20 (eighteen years ago) link

I prefer 'crowning glory'.

― Pete W (peterw), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:22 (eighteen years ago) link

I thought it was great, personally. It was an off the ball incident, so it didn't affect what was happening in the game. Materazzi wasn't really injured, managed to carry on playing, and won the World Cup, so I'm sure he's not too fussed. Zidane got sent off, so he missed out on the chance of finishing his career with by winning the World Cup. He's had his punishment. France didn't lose because he got sent off, they lost because Italy were great at penalties. We've got an iconic moment to remember. Everyone's a winner. (Except the French)

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Well, it certainly seems to have overshadowed the World Cup. I think that's kind of a shame.

It hasn't really overshadowed the whole tournament, maybe just the final, but I'm sure nobody in Italy is wailing "Che peccato! All'estero si parla solo di Zidane". (spelling?)

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:27 (eighteen years ago) link

"but I'm sure nobody in Italy is wailing "Che peccato! All'estero si parla solo di Zidane". (spelling?)"

totally correct! :)

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:32 (eighteen years ago) link

and another thing...lots of people on this thread have said words to the effect of "France were slighly better last night, but Italy were better over the tournament". I don't really agree - I think they were pretty even. France had a poor start, but were great against Spain and Brazil. Italy had a fairly easy route to the semis, but still nearly lost against such major world forces as Australia and 9-man USA. Italy v Germany was great, France v Portugal was not, but you can only beat the opponents in front of you and France did that with a comfortable 1-0, whereas the Italian match was unbelievably close until they broke through in the 119th minute. Anyway, it's irrelevant what happened over the tournament, it's what happens on the night that matters (otherwise Argentina or Germany would have won it).

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:46 (eighteen years ago) link

OTM. I was going to post something similar on the other thread and now I don't need to.

― ailsa (ailsa), Monday, 10 July 2006 15:51 (eighteen years ago) link

"meritate tutti ciò, voi gli enculato di musulmani, sporchi
terroristici"
This is the latest rumour about what Mazeratti has really said

umm... even if this is true, does ZZ speak italian? i don't think he does (?), which would render the exchange pointless. would the insult have been hurled in english? or does paterazzi speak french? blah blah.. i'm sure it will all come out eventually - i'm tiring of the speculation already!

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:00 (eighteen years ago) link

i thought henry single handedly got france into the final by diving and getting the freekicks/penalties?

(or single leggedly i guess)

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane played in juventus for a few years so could have picked up some italian there.. Dunno though!

― ken c (ken c), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:02 (eighteen years ago) link

er, "Materazzi", of course (x-post)

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:05 (eighteen years ago) link

Perhaps the overshadowing is only here, in animated gif land. I will have to wait till I get home to find out.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:09 (eighteen years ago) link

you hate fun

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:12 (eighteen years ago) link

(xpost to ken) ahh, true... and i imagine even if he only picked up a small bit of italian, curses and insults would be learned pretty quickly

― Rob Bolton (Rob Bolton), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:14 (eighteen years ago) link

IMO, this will make people adore ZZ even more - it proves he's "human just like us" & stuff (also, it's going to be the enduring image of this world cup, which probably wouldn't have happened with just a normal match)

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:28 (eighteen years ago) link

French and Italian are close enough that he probably could have picked up the drift.

― theantmustdance (theantmustdance), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:35 (eighteen years ago) link

i feel this issue is far from being over... A french association "sos racisme" as complained to fifa and asked for an investigation... and zidane's spokesman has said he will talk in a few days... rejoice, the world cup fever is not gone !

― AleXTC (AleXTC), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:37 (eighteen years ago) link

ps ciao Ned!!!

Hurrah! Will write you soon.

(Am I right and is Allyzay finally realizing the brilliance of football over this tournament? How right and proper.)

Anyway, right now I'm just waiting on the Serie A expulsions.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Adidas will still be launching mercizidane.fr on July 15th, where everyone can thank him for his career, using text messages and videos. The two best videos will win prizes (e.g. the shirt he wore yesterday could be one of the prizes).

"He's still under contract until 2017, so Adidas will support him"

... is about the gist of this here article in a Belgian newspaper.

― StanM (StanM), Monday, 10 July 2006 16:47 (eighteen years ago) link

The English language version of the Italian federation site, while currently being hit hard, is providing much joy, some unintentional. But this headline is great no matter what:

CANNAVARO: " I HAD PROMISED
MY CHILDREN THAT
THEY WOULD HAVE SLEPT
WITH THE WORLD CUP"

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 17:41 (eighteen years ago) link

I also favor:

WORLD CHAMPIONS!
ITALY YELLS OUT LOUD
AND BECOMES HISTORY:
THIS IS THE FOURTH TITLE

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 17:45 (eighteen years ago) link

With a great closing sentence:

Captain Cannavaro raises the trophy above his head and the sky has never been so blue.

Very cool. :-)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 17:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Ronaldo is such a fancy-boy I can't believe it. The pic of him in today's Guardian, too, is priceless. He's got on huge aviator sunglasses, a blinding white shirt with huge collar and dark blazer on and he's doing one of those huge toothy Tom Cruise grins. "Hotcha!"

The day after, Zidane's sending off seems more like just one of those things that happens. In the moment it really was shocking. But if this were the 12th inning of Game 7 of the World Series, for instance, or the last minute of double-overtime in the NBA Finals, and somebody did this - even somebody with the fair-play rep of Derek Jeter, or Tim Duncan - the reaction would be "boys will be boys," pretty much. Or "daaaaaaaaamn." In any case, the English papers' rough treatment of Zidane - "truly appalling;" "unfathomable;" "despicable;" - seems out of whack.

xpost: I was watching Cannavaro during the penalties at the end. He never even smiled until it was over, it was impressive.

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 10 July 2006 17:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Focus, my friend.

Anyway, an image I hadn't yet seen:

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41869000/jpg/_41869338_zidane270.jpg

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 17:53 (eighteen years ago) link

I mean, completely out of context that's just wonderful.

"ZIDANE MY FRIEND! I throw myself gleefully at your feet."

"The hell?"

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 17:54 (eighteen years ago) link

way long xpost:

It strikes me that the World Cup - and football championships generally - are very different from American sports in that everyone always remembers the loser as well. In the US, nobody does

tell that to the buffalo bills or the '86 red sox!!!!!

― hstencil (hstencil), Monday, 10 July 2006 17:56 (eighteen years ago) link

I think if Tim Duncan cold-cocked someone in the face in overtime of game 7 of the NBA Finals, it would be a big deal. Especially if the only provacation was a guy just talking smack after a basket.

― Super Cub (Debito), Monday, 10 July 2006 18:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Reuters - I've just spoken to a friend at work there - have put it to Materazzi that he did in fact call him a 'dirty Muslim terrorist' and they report that in his denial Materazzi basically said "well I never called him a TERRORIST'. Schmuck.

― suzy (suzy), Monday, 10 July 2006 18:25 (eighteen years ago) link

ugh, that's horrible. OK, I have to say, I am just baffled by all the racist taunts that seem to happen in football and wonder how it is permitted to continue year after year?

yesterday I was just stunned and saddened but now I'm like, well, I side with ZZ.

― dar1a g (daria g), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:03 (eighteen years ago) link

"It is absolutely not true, I did not call him a terrorist," Materazzi told Italian news agency Ansa.
"I'm ignorant. I don't even know what the word means.

"The whole world saw what happened on live TV."

Materazzi = Fat Tony!

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:08 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/world_cup_2006/teams/france/5164094.stm

"It is absolutely not true, I did not call him a terrorist. I'm ignorant. I don't even know what the word means," the Italian news agency Ansa quoted Materazzi as saying after the Italian team returned to Rome.

Materazzi's agent Claudio Vigorelli said: "I've known Marco for a long time and I don't think he is capable of provoking a player. He is a good boy."

I found the 'terrorist' theory fairly unlikely, but these two denials are of such poor quality that perhaps it's true.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:18 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm ignorant. I don't even know what the word means

!!!

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh you guys are making a meal out of a few crumbs here, we're talking about translations and stuff. I'm sure he said something awful but there's no proof here of the "dirty Muslim" theory.

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Some French sources are saying that Materazzi insulted Zidane's first coach, Jean Vennard, who he saw as a second father. Vennard died of a long battle against cancer before the match against Spain, and Materazzi is said to have said that he hope Vennard had suffered in pain.

― Dave B (daveb), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Anyway, nobody got hurt, the bad man got sent off and his team gained no advantage from his foul and then lost. Not like this famous World Cup incident:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ziCPQk_Zn80&search=battiston

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:29 (eighteen years ago) link

Despite their perhaps well-deserved reputation as mental dullards, even a for a footballer to claim not to know what terrorist means is beyond belief.

Materazzi was banned for two months for hitting Siena defender Bruno Cirillo after taunting him from the bench thoughout the match in early 2004. He's no stranger to taunting.

http://www.gazzetta.it/Foto%20Hermes/2004/02-Febbraio/02/cirillo--232x157.jpg

― M. White (Miguelito), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, it's beyond belief all right, but that doesn't prove he said it either. So far I've heard that Materazzi talked about Zidane's mother, his father, his sister, his race, his country, and his coach. Let's see how many more rumors we hear before Zidane actually speaks, okay?

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh yeah I forgot the famous "HE TWEAKED HIS NIPPLE, ZZ HAD TO RETALIATE" theory too.

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:50 (eighteen years ago) link

ZZ's headbutt reminded me of his penalty kicks. A casual step or two forward and *boom* - hits his target.

― Collardio Gelatinous (collardio), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link

zz's gran died of excessive nipple tweaking. this is well-known factoid.

― andrew m. (andrewmorgan), Monday, 10 July 2006 19:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh come on, Reuters are properly impartial and have had time to employ a lip-reader, Materazzi couched his denial in words that made it VERY clear what WAS said. Helped of course by Materazzi responding like a bratty kid wot finks he's clever.

― suzy (suzy), Monday, 10 July 2006 20:10 (eighteen years ago) link

link to the article please?

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 10 July 2006 20:13 (eighteen years ago) link

see above

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Monday, 10 July 2006 20:14 (eighteen years ago) link

That is a BBC article, not Reuters, and it says that the insult was directed against Zidane's family, not his terrorist or Muslim status. I'm talking about Suzy's friend at Reuters who has employed a lipreader.

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 10 July 2006 20:19 (eighteen years ago) link

and who is this Wot Finks character, he sounds like a card-happy Belgian referee

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Monday, 10 July 2006 20:21 (eighteen years ago) link

itv news reports that materazzi said "i slept with your mother last night...your mother is an algerian whore".

zizou was extra upset as his mother was admitted to hospital yesterday.

― michael wells (michael w.), Monday, 10 July 2006 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link

hstencil, cf the words "everyone" and "always"

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Super Cub - while I have no doubt that's true, I do doubt that you would hear words like "unfathomable" or "despicable" or "truly appalling" or "leaves his career in utter humiliation" etc etc.

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Materazzi's 5 best fouls

― M. White (Miguelito), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Meantime, I note that the US contingent has said nothing about the true foul of yesterday -- the idiocy behind whoever at ABC thought that random U2 tour footage of "Where The Streets Have No Name" and "One" made for good opening and closing montages.

Oh, and the existence of Brent Musberger. Hey, did you know that the stadium was where Jesse Owens won all those medals?!? Can I tell you AGAIN?!?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:36 (eighteen years ago) link

Ned, OTM.

I'm not saying that US coverage shouldn't be a little US-centric for the sake of the viewers and the Owens story still resonates but when you repeat a 60 year old story about another sport with no reference to the teams playing on the day, you're not exactly what one might call well-directed or well-edited.

― M. White (Miguelito), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Helping to calm my nerves

― M. White (Miguelito), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:41 (eighteen years ago) link

Fouls 4 through 1 are really not very nice.

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Zidane's an ass for reacting, whatever Materazzi said, but that doesn't make Materazzi any less of a thuggish twat. I particularly like the two footed tackle and the shin to the nads - they're proper class, they are.

― M. White (Miguelito), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:47 (eighteen years ago) link

Come on, Foul 1 is a fucking humdinger. An absolute classic.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:53 (eighteen years ago) link

Interesting compound noun choice there, Matt.

― M. White (Miguelito), Monday, 10 July 2006 21:56 (eighteen years ago) link

A humming fuckdinger?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 10 July 2006 22:00 (eighteen years ago) link

"Come on, Foul 1 is a fucking humdinger. An absolute classic."

His reaction afterwards is pretty classic. The whole I am going to tie up my shirt and look absolutely unrepentent thing hah!

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Monday, 10 July 2006 22:09 (eighteen years ago) link

U2 = European but people know who they are

it takes many stones to build an arch Ned. At this rate Americans will get into the World Cup ca. 2475

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 10 July 2006 22:13 (eighteen years ago) link

"people" = Americans obviously

i think

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 10 July 2006 22:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Being an American sports fan and giving this event an honest try, I have to wonder if this was a pretty sucky version of the World Cup to try and make a convert. It seemed that way too many games was either decided by a bad referee's call, some player foul theatrics or by that dorky penalty shootout. I can see having the shootout at the end of the first round and maybe the knockout games so they don't go seven hours, but criminy for the championship? They should play until someone scores.

Was this an especially bad version of the World Cup? It seemed from my eyes only the Mexico/Argentina matchup and the end of the Italy/Germany game seemed to have this "magic" that all of the ads seem to allude to about football. Is it common for so many games to be decided by a free penalty kick or a shootout? I just didn't see as much expected of this razzle dazzle beautiful game.

― Earl Nash (earlnash), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

How many games in (say) the Stanley Cup Finals are classic, though? Or the World Series? How many games of anything become transcendent? I watch football a lot, and have for years, and only a small percentage of games are truly awe-inspiring, indelible. Which is true of other sports. And yet football (soccer) remains my favourite by a vast distance still. Of all sports, it has the capacity, the potential, to almost transcend life, at least, and that is why it is loved so universally.

― David A. (Davant), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 00:13 (eighteen years ago) link

But no, this wasn't the best World Cup ever.

― David A. (Davant), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 00:14 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh, and for the ILX Vancouverphiles out there... yesterday, Commercial Drive was a sheer pleasure, from beginning to end (or from 1st to Venables, anyway). I've watched every World Cup Final on the Drive since Italia '90, and it was a crowning moment of sheer vicarious glory(hunting) to experience Italy winning the whole enchilada (or the whole focaccia?) among Italians. What an incredible party.

I was talking to some Italian fans at half time, and we bonded over our respective teams' penalty shootout records. Believe me, no-one in the cafe I watched it in wanted Italy to go to a shootout, and I really doubt the players wanted to either. When we saw what Zidane did, there was the oddest kind of cheer I ever heard -- it was a combination of "our chances just improved", "holy fuck", and "I'm impressed with the sheer audacity of Zizou's madness", tempered by a kind of quiet sadness at what the media might do to him should France lose. It was truly a bizarre moment. Great great day and a very good game of football, despite the naysayers.

― David A. (Davant), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 00:28 (eighteen years ago) link

"Zidane's an ass for reacting, whatever Materazzi said, but that doesn't make Materazzi any less of a thuggish twat"

Materazzi is a nasty son of a bitch, but Zizou isn't that better: does anyone remember when he stomped a Saudi player at World Cup 98 or when he head-butted a Hamburg player when he was still with Juventus? Zidane has been extremely nervous for all the tournament and just snapped one more time: when you're the captain of your team and you're playing the World Cup you just cannot allow yourself to react like this (exactly like it happened to Totti some years ago).

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 06:04 (eighteen years ago) link

I do not hate fun, Konal. I just hate digital fun.

It is nice of the world's media to employ lip readers, but it would be even nicer if they went the extra mile and employed a translator as well - YOU ARE THE SON OF A TERRORIST WHORE indeed. He's not the son of a terorrist whore, he's just a very naughty boy.

I think Dave Boyle's theory is the most convincing, and I think his inside information is likely to be more reliable than Reuters (although only in this case).

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 06:58 (eighteen years ago) link

My inside info was French newspapers, so not an insight on any level sadly. I agr4eed with this post oin the WSC board:

What happened was - Zidane was on the receiving end of physical and verbal niggle, as he has been for decades, and on this occasion he chose to react with a head-butt, as opposed to the countless other times when he's reacted by outclassing the opponent and winning the game. That simple, really. Twat stays on, bigger twat goes off.

This search for the one insult-to-beat-all-other-insults is quite amusing though. Did it involve mother/race/cancer/terrorism/sexual acts with kittens? It's like Monty Python's sketch about the ultimate, deadly joke, which won the war or something. Materazzi has split the verbal atom

― Dave B (daveb), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 07:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh, I thought it was an international underground network of concerned football fans of some sort :-(

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 08:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Speaking of which, I was delighted to see Markelby's "FOLLOW THE DONS" car sticker the other day.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 08:33 (eighteen years ago) link

YOU DONS

― Earwig oh! (Mark C), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 08:53 (eighteen years ago) link

They seemed to have quite a long exchange, I imagine Materazzi said all of the things that have been suggested, in sequence.

― Fraggle O Rly (Ferg), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 09:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Is it significant that Zizou will tell us what was said "later this week"? Why on earth didn't he just tell us right after the match? Are he and his team of lawyers watching the footage over and over again, working out the worst possible insult that would fit with Materazzi's mouth movements a la 'elephant shoe'?

― Mädchen (Madchen), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 09:49 (eighteen years ago) link

When the seaguill throws herrings over the trawler...

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 09:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah yeah, OK, the headbutt.

But what about Materazzi's left leg as he goes down? Isn't that a kick?

http://www.8erhoekers.nl/zidane.gif

― StanM (StanM), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 09:52 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm still hoping it was just something like "you have a funny name and are a slaphead".

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 09:54 (eighteen years ago) link

"olive juice"

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 09:54 (eighteen years ago) link

"It seemed that way too many games was either decided by a bad referee's call, some player foul theatrics or by that dorky penalty shootout"

Well, this is what we love about football and its real essence.
Its not a sport, its a game - it's unfair, unpredictable, often boring, you don't need particular athletic gifts, the final winner isn't necessarily the best team and definitely luck is a lot more important than technical skills. It can't be better than this.

― Marco Damiani (Marco D.), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 12:27 (eighteen years ago) link

But Materazzi added: "I am ignorant, I don't even know what an Islamic terrorist is; my only terrorist is her," he said pointing to his 10-month-old daughter.

He hasn't lost his sense of humour, then.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 12:59 (eighteen years ago) link

It would be funny if his daughter actually went on to be a terrorist and kill him.

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 13:06 (eighteen years ago) link

Terrorism is worse than racialist jibes tho. I'm sure of it.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 13:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Berlin's top World Cup official shot himself in the head just hours after the tournament ended and is now fighting for his life

:-/

"Don't kill yourself Mister WM - the tournament was widely seen as a great success for the host nation!"

― Alba (Alba), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 13:40 (eighteen years ago) link

the hell!?? is this the weirdest world cup ever?

― dar1a g (daria g), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 14:25 (eighteen years ago) link

it'd be funny if zinedine zidane turns out to be materazzi's daughter.

― ken c (ken c), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 14:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Or if Materazzi's daughter turns out to have been responsible for the renewed wave of Brigate Rosse attacks.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 14:53 (eighteen years ago) link

But what about Materazzi's left leg as he goes down? Isn't that a kick?

According to this, it is!

http://wdwwa.biz/zidane/z43840064.gif

― Jena (JenaP), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 14:54 (eighteen years ago) link

materazzi's daughter

Isn't that a Fall song?

― Venga (Venga), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 14:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Is it significant that Zizou will tell us what was said "later this week"? Why on earth didn't he just tell us right after the match?

I think this explains why:

The alleged insult to his mother was described as especially explosive because she had been taken to hospital gravely ill on the day of the Cup final, and yesterday Zidane rushed back to Marseilles to be at her bedside. Zidane's agent said the star was provoked by Materazzi and would explain what happened in a few days.

― StanM (StanM), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 15:12 (eighteen years ago) link

I still love Zizou, but I think it's ridiculous to imagine that he won't forever be associated with this particular incident.

― pleased to mitya (mitya), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 15:49 (eighteen years ago) link

of course he will but that's what will make him a larger than just a great footballer figure. he's now in the mythical pop icon territory. I have to say I was never that impressed by him (and i'm a french guy who's had some of his best times ever with the 98 and 2000 finals). since the 06 final, I am truly fascinated and love him like never before!

― AleXTC (AleXTC), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 15:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Redis ça et je te fous un coup de boule...

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 16:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Mieux qu'un coup de pied aux couilles, style-Materazzi contre Schevtchenko, quand même.

― M. White (Miguelito), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 16:17 (eighteen years ago) link

I have to say, reading US reactions on this, it's kind of funny seeing a lot of "I wasn't really interested in soccer before.. but that French guy is AWESOME"

― dar1a g (daria g), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 19:45 (eighteen years ago) link

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m261/disbister/Zidane-small.gif

― schwantz (schwantz), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 20:15 (eighteen years ago) link

"I have to say I was never that impressed by him"

*shakes head in disbelief*

WHO have you been impressed by? Guivarch? Karembeu? Do tell.

― Lovelace (Lovelace), Tuesday, 11 July 2006 22:45 (eighteen years ago) link

As to what Dar1a says, my whole office was discussing Zidane today as were the guys across the way at the lunch. This could be the long awaited event that gets America into soccer!

I'm curious though, is the head-butt a typically soccer type thing to do? Wouldn't throwing a punch be somehow more "manly" or effective?

― Mary (Mary), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 00:26 (eighteen years ago) link

The headbutting action comes more naturally to footballers, I think.

Also, I can't speak for France, but in the UK, headbutting is very much a feature of street and/or bar fights. It's certainly not considered less "manly" than a punch in that context. Actual punches in football (soccer) are relatively rare for some reason. In the UK, spitting is seen as worse than pretty much anything, although it's more common in other European countries (see Mark Viduka when he first went to Scotland).

― David A. (Davant), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 00:35 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah Mary, lots of people at my office talking about it too. I read the French newspapers and it's all this talk, talk, talk trying to figure out the mystery behind this and why he did it and how tragic it was and on and on. And then watching the clip, uh, as an American my first reaction is.. Wow, that was badass.

PWND

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 00:53 (eighteen years ago) link

is the head-butt a typically soccer type thing to do? Wouldn't throwing a punch be somehow more "manly" or effective?

kind of the opposite, i reckon. disregarding zidane's innovation for a second, the majority of headbutts are normally sly little sudden nods forward that evolve from your average vocal tete a tete (say in disputing a partic bad tackle). and generally there's nothing wrong in having an big shouty argument provided it doesnt get physical, it being a man's game and so on etc, so headbutting fouls tend to operate just under a cloak of errrm legitimacy if u see what i mean. though that's at the extreme of the scale - most football needle resolves itself through tackling with a little bit extra thrown in, or happening to shoulderbarge yr foe, or falling off balance so that you stamp on em, whatever. it's all to do with bending the rules, and sneaking shit past the headmaster/ref without him seeing you, so really it's all v bitchy indeed. (i should say that italians and south americans and well yeah, foreigners in general are usually the ones stylized as being versed in the "dark arts" as it were, but everyone does it and always has done.)

now u see cos it's 4am and i cannot fucking get to sleep, for no reason i've just written a big long paragraph about stuff wot happens in all sports ever. the point is i think that in football doing something that obviously and brashly disrupts the game like throwing a punch is considered quite vain and showbizzy (cough american) cos it is basically saying that ooh you just can't taaaaake it anymore, you don't caaaare if the ref catches you, you have to get it off your cheeeest, which in turn is taken to mean that it's all gotten too much for you and ur just being a fanny swinging yr handbag about like that. watching ice hockey and basketball you get the impression players think they have, or rather do actually have, the human right to stop a game for their tiffs. anyway, hence 'effective' doesnt factor into 'manly' at all.

except when, i dunno, it's like super gangsta effective. then it's ok.

― rtccc (mwah), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 02:37 (eighteen years ago) link

Throwing a punch seemed to me more effective, because it is an opener. The puncher would imagine to instigate a reaction, I would assume. The other player would hit back, then other teammates would join in, and before you know it the fans would run into the stadium and it would be pandemonium. Though if you punched an Italian soccer player, perhaps they would fall immediately to the floor?

Also, the head butt, head to head, would seem to hurt the instigator's head more, and possibly do more damage to the self. The head to head makes a bit more sense, since you are level and don't have to swoop down. Did Z. create the heat to stomach, or is that somewhat common?

― Mary (Mary), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 02:58 (eighteen years ago) link

NO HANDS IN FOOTBALL UNLESS YOU'RE THE GOALIE

sheesh

― hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 02:58 (eighteen years ago) link

What about the throw in?

― Mary (Mary), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 03:03 (eighteen years ago) link

OUT OF BOUNDS

― hstencil (hstencil), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 03:06 (eighteen years ago) link

the current story on Libé is a treat:

En tuant lui-même le rêve qu'il avait initié, Zidane est resté insaisissable jusqu'au bout. Pour certains, le geste touche au sublime. Explications.

awesome. I miss France

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 03:06 (eighteen years ago) link

In the UK, spitting is seen as worse than pretty much anything, although it's more common in other European countries (see Mark Viduka when he first went to Scotland).

Do you mean Scotland is another European country outside the UK (it's not)? Or do you mean Mark (or Marko, as he was back then) Viduka learned how to spit when he was at Croatia Zagreb and then drowned West Central Scotland in his spittle when he got here, not knowing how unacceptable he was being?

(hasn't everyone pretty much forgotten the Frank Riijkard/Rudi Voller spitting thing, now that Riijkard's gone on to further success?)

― ailsa (ailsa), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 05:40 (eighteen years ago) link

My guess is that the office conversations are caused by the neverending stream of animated gifs rather than the incident itself.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 06:25 (eighteen years ago) link

For the francophones out there, le nouveau tube de l'été, "Coup de Boule": http://www.yousendit.com/transfer.php?action=download&ufid=1BF089A8271D4364

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 06:47 (eighteen years ago) link

(hasn't everyone pretty much forgotten the Frank Riijkard/Rudi Voller spitting thing, now that Riijkard's gone on to further success?)

Apart from the fact the clip gets wheeled out before every major tournament for maximum lols?

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 07:20 (eighteen years ago) link

ROFL @ Coup de Boule! Fantastique!

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 07:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Every morning for he next 4 years: http://www.wallak.net/zidan/

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 07:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, I can't speak for France, but in the UK, headbutting is very much a feature of street and/or bar fights.

When I saw it I thought, "Ah, that must be a manoeuvre from the mean streets of Marseille!", because I've never seen anyone headbutt someone like that before. The method I'm more familiar with is the quick butt to the bridge of the nose - I've had it done to me tho my assailant was so short he only managed to butt me in the mouth (and, no it wasn't a five year old or a toddler but a standard issue 5 foot 2 Glasgow ned). Butting someone in the chest is odd too, tho I suppose Materazzi is about 6 foot 4 and if it had been Gattuso or someone his head would have come off his shoulders.

― Dadaismus (Are we in love like I think we be?) (Dada), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Moi aussi, j'adore Coup de Boule.

― Daniel Giraffe (Daniel Giraffe), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:19 (eighteen years ago) link

...the song, that is.

― Daniel Giraffe (Daniel Giraffe), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Klinsmann quits.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:21 (eighteen years ago) link

Nah, he was aiming for the chest. Quite restrained really.

When I had it done to me it broke both my nose and my famous front tooth. I wonder how that happened.

Klinsmann has resgined, or refused to sign a contract extension or whatever. Good move, Jurgen.

Oh look, I have been beaten to it.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:22 (eighteen years ago) link

Lippi quits.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:28 (eighteen years ago) link

I've been headbutted in the nose, it sucks.

― Jarlr'mai (jarlrmai), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:29 (eighteen years ago) link

WTF Lippi? the other day he said he wanted to carry on and saw no reason to step down. oh wait that was the obvious giveaway he would resign eh.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Anyone speak Russian?

http://www.ljplus.ru/img/p/o/pooopsik/zidane_mat.gif

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:49 (eighteen years ago) link

What Materazzi said to Zidane: "Hello!"
I don't really get the joke

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:53 (eighteen years ago) link

"coup de boule" is so gonna be this summer's hit in france. I can already see the "danse du coup de boule" moves on the dance floors all over the country.
aaah... vive la france !
(and regarding zidane, i know it's crazy but i really never felt he was that genius/greatest player ever eveybody raved about... only now with the headbutt have i seen the light !).

― AleXTC (AleXTC), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:55 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't know if it's supposed to be a joke or not, don't understand Russian myself :(

(xpost)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 08:55 (eighteen years ago) link

http://pics.livejournal.com/cureall/pic/00006f2b.gif

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 09:01 (eighteen years ago) link

well done fifa rankings, there:

http://www.fifa.com/en/mens/statistics/index/0,2548,All-Jul-2006,00.html

http://www.thefa.com/WorldCup2006/NewsAndFeatures/Postings/2006/07/England_rankings_jump.htm

the best thing about the story on the FA site is this bit:

A new method has been used to calculate this eagerly awaited first World Ranking since the 2006 FIFA World Cup, which not only introduces major changes in points allocation and the assessment of the opposition’s strength, but also makes such factors as the importance of the match and regional strength easier to understand.

This new formula and the big points hauls gained from World Cup matches has led to a complete shake up in the ranking. Besides the effect of the World Cup matches, the change in the evaluation period has also led to a major shift. Now only the last four years (48 months) count, with each year weighted differently.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, NOT ENOUGH DETAIL!!!!

― CarsmileSteve (CarsmileSteve), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 09:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Those scenes in movies where someone in a bar starts a fight, and all of a sudden everyone in the place starts to beat up each other for no proper reason at all. Classic or dud?

― steal compass, drive north, disappear (tissp), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 09:50 (eighteen years ago) link

scotland shoot up 18 places to just outside the top 40

― RJG (RJG), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 09:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Media World, an Italian electronics store, promised to pay back your TV if the Italian team won the world cup! (video here) - does this say there are 10.000 customers who bought one?)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 09:51 (eighteen years ago) link

this new system also benefits Scotland considerably i notice. (xpost)

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 09:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Marcello, Jurgen come to England you know we love you crazy foreigners.

Anyway back to Berlin in four years time or paying visits to Ned and Dan if this comes to pass, South Africa World Cup in doubt.

― Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 10:14 (eighteen years ago) link

It's the infamous Russian 'Превед':

http://prevedmedved.ru/uploads/posts/1142678294_000001.jpg

Guess where the first Google-result for Превед leads to...

― Gerard (Gerard), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 10:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Ten worst players of the World Cup, as voted for by bbc.co.uk users:

Adriano 6.46
Ferdinand 6.46
Juan 6.43
Cafu 6.42
Carlos 6.41
Govou 6.34
Costinha 6.22
Robinson 6.16
Wiltord 6.02
Lampard 5.98

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 11:11 (eighteen years ago) link

What's with the Rio hate?

― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 11:40 (eighteen years ago) link

The next person to post an animated ZZ gif gets a smack in the mouth.

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 11:48 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't think I've ever seen Michael threaten violence before. I think we should take his threat seriously.

― Alba (Alba), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 11:51 (eighteen years ago) link

MichaelJ, I had no idea. Apologies.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 11:54 (eighteen years ago) link

(on the other hand: where are you, location-wise?)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 11:56 (eighteen years ago) link

(on the other hand: where are you, location-wise?)

I'm in your house. Right now. Dial your number.

I'm only kiddin', divvies.

I see Everton are still owed a £500k instalment for the sale of Mad Marco to Perugia in '99. Sequester their assets!

― Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 13:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Get him back!

LION!

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 13:25 (eighteen years ago) link

ZZ is going to explain on (French pay TV) Canal + in a couple of hours:

http://media.canal-plus.com/image/36/6/45366.jpg

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:32 (eighteen years ago) link

finally! is it possible to listen live en direct anywhere?

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:37 (eighteen years ago) link

move to France, quick! (less than two hours to go and get a subscription to Canal + France)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:41 (eighteen years ago) link

On va compter sur toi, Stan, de nous relater ce qu'il dit.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:45 (eighteen years ago) link

On peut recevoir C+ en Belgique??

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:45 (eighteen years ago) link

:-(

I think I've given the wrong impression there: I'm in Belgium, where we can't get that particular brand of Canal + either...

(xpost)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:48 (eighteen years ago) link

That list of worst players is ridiculous. Except maybe the inclusion of Lampard.

― Matt DC (Matt DC), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:54 (eighteen years ago) link

i will watch it at a friend's place.
WC fever all over again...

― AleXTC (AleXTC), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:58 (eighteen years ago) link

no canal +! oh no! there is radio france online, certainly they'll report it quickly enough. or maybe even some details will leak ahead of the broadcast? after all it is surely a taped interview and somebody knows what ZZ said

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:58 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2slJ9CBnk0

― gbx (skowly), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 14:59 (eighteen years ago) link

Also: did Zidane actually promise to tell us the exact words Materazzi used?

(because that's what we all seem to expect, but he could just as well say he can't tell us because the FIFA investigation hasn't finished yet)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:02 (eighteen years ago) link

No, I really cannot imagine that ZZ will report what Materazzi said. He'll probably just say he's sorry and ask forgiveness for his behavior, ask all the kids out there not to copy him, blablabla.

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:04 (eighteen years ago) link

From that gbx angle, it's quite clearly the final few words that Materazzi says (the ones that are usually translated as "Go fuck yourself") that caused him to react, rather than any of the pre-amble, from which he's still smiling at. Or maybe EVIL RACIST I-TIE MOTHER ABUSING brings a smile to his lips. Who. Can. Tell?

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:07 (eighteen years ago) link

yes - I don't think he promised to tell. in fact I doubt he would want to repeat it. is FIFA even investigating what Materazzi said for that matter, or is the investigation more about video replay? also, do longtime fans of the sport have as low an opinion of FIFA as I do right now. "Say no to racism" campaign, sure. I get that trash talking is part of any sport but for crying out loud it's near the end of the last game for one of the great players, can Italy not show a little respect and ease up on the deliberate provocation

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:09 (eighteen years ago) link

"A time to make friends"

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Why put Lampard on the list ahead of Ronaldinho anyway? Other than 'on paper' the latter is better than the former. Of course you may argue that the latter DID perform better than Lampard in the World Cup generally but I'm not so sure.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:14 (eighteen years ago) link

He's expected to explain the nature of the slur hurled at him before Sunday's incident.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Chelsea and Real Madrid both after Cannavaro

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:19 (eighteen years ago) link

For latest on the Zidane interview: keep your eyes on a couple of French football forums:

http://www.soccers.fr/index.php?showforum=68
http://forums.eurosport.fr/forumdisplay.php?f=34

and the front page of:
http://www.eurosport.fr/

(although we're going to find out minutes later on most other news sites as well, I presume)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:29 (eighteen years ago) link

Meanwhile, a French lawyer wants to cancel the result of the final because the referee didn't see the incident himself (more claims of TV replay refereeing) :

(in french)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:32 (eighteen years ago) link

it's near the end of the last game for one of the great players, can Italy not show a little respect and ease up on the deliberate provocation

It's also THE FINAL OF TEH WORLD CUP. If it was racist, absolutely, we should all condemn Matarazzi for a cowardly, awful act. If it's not, if it was just more of the trash talk that we must assume goes on all the time on the pitch, then I don't see a problem. ZZ's reaction demonstrates the effectiveness of such tactics. (again, all of this is moot if it was, indeed, a racist comment)

xposts obv

― gooblar (gooblar), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:36 (eighteen years ago) link

it's near the end of the last game for one of the great players, can Italy not show a little respect and ease up on the deliberate provocation

Hell, yeah! They should also have scored an own goal, conceded another penalty for him to score, then bowed down and worshipped at his feet as he lifted the cup he so richly deserved as one of the world's great players. Shall we just ignore the fact that he was on the pitch with several other great players? Or that someone who's reached the age of 34 (? - I'm guessing here) might have learned to hang onto his temper under any sort of pressure?

(x-post - original post poxy-fuled into oblivion)

― ailsa (ailsa), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:49 (eighteen years ago) link

From StanM's link:
Despite feverish speculation over the reasons for his gesture, France's favourite footballing hero has received overwhelming support from the public -- with 61 percent telling a national newspaper that they forgive him and 52 percent that they understand his behaviour.

Forgiveness, I can understand that, but understanding? Before he even gave his version of the story of it? Oh, pollpaws...

No doubt Zidane will give the people a tearjerker story about all the horrible things Materazzi said to him. What I'm most curious about is if he condemns in some way the action he undertook. Physical violence still negatively pwns calling names or cursing for me. No matter how genius the player (because a genius on the pitch he was).

― Gerard (Gerard), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:51 (eighteen years ago) link

If it was racist, absolutely, we should all condemn Matarazzi for a cowardly, awful act.

If it's a racist jibe he may well be punished in accordance with FIFA anti-racism policies (er, assuming they have them like the FA). If it could be construed as homophobic or misoynistic (re insulting his mother) in some way, no-one will give half as much of a shit. Makes you think.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 15:54 (eighteen years ago) link

They had all those anti-racism speeches before the matches, didn't they (I'm guessing they did one before the final, I didn't see the build-up), so it would seem rather silly for them not to be making examples of people who couldn't remember the point of it for the following couple of hours.

― ailsa (ailsa), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:00 (eighteen years ago) link

ailsa, that's ridiculous re: all the stuff you wrote earlier. Come on!

I don't expect he'll give a tearjerker story at all, in fact I rather doubt he'll even put the blame on what Materazzi said.

understanding? sure. why not understanding? someone is under an enormous amount of pressure and the game is exhausting and frustrating and he did get injured earlier. I don't think there is anyone in this world who is guaranteed to always hold on to his/her temper under any kind of pressure. sorry

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Even if what was said was racist, Zidane should have kept his cool and reported it to FIFA afterwards, instead of descending to the level of violence. Then Materazzi would be the villain as opposed to the both of them. I imagine (or at least hope) that Zidane is smart enough to spend more time being contrite than seeking to justify his actions through the vileness of what Materazzi may have said.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:08 (eighteen years ago) link

dar1a, I know it's ridiculous, that was kind of my point. Suggesting he gets an easier ride of it because it's his last game and he's quite good is also ridiculous. It's a COMPETITION. PEOPLE DO STUFF TO GAIN AN ADVANTAGE!

― ailsa (ailsa), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:11 (eighteen years ago) link

However for the French public, as Madame de Staël put it, "Tout comprendre rend tres indulgent."

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:12 (eighteen years ago) link

I liked the violence - it was pure slapstick. (xxxpost)

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:16 (eighteen years ago) link

I guess what I was trying to say was gee, how about somebody not bombard the guy with racist abuse. I'd appreciate it if you could be a little generous instead of insulting my intelligence here by shouting at me that a football match is a competition. Thanks, I'm aware of that.

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:17 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, sorry, you just seemed to be suggesting he was somewhat more not worthy of (racist*) abuse than crappier or less-close-to-retiring players.

*not that we know it was racist, of course

― ailsa (ailsa), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:20 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't get all this hype over what Materazzi said - only he and Zidane know, and it's one word against another's. Even if Zidane claims it was racist, there's no way to prove it.

If there had been other players on the pitch who had been close and had heard, then it would be a different matter, but really, nothing's going to change the outcome, or at least nothing SHOULD change the outcome.

All this jumping to conclusions about what was said, 'expert' lip-readers giving conflicting accounts, it's all a complete waste of time.

― Vicky (Vicky), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:25 (eighteen years ago) link

esp. when the lip-readers all seem to have such different ideas about what he said!

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:29 (eighteen years ago) link

Nothing yet, everyone's in front of the TV at the moment...

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:57 (eighteen years ago) link

OK, he apologises for the headbutt, but he was insulted with "very hard words"

http://www.eurosport.fr/football/tp_sto924803.shtml

Football - 12/07/2006 - 19:47
Zidane s'excuse

Zinédine Zidane s'est excusé, sur Canal+, pour avoir asséné un coup de tête au défenseur italien Marco Materazzi lors de la finale entre la France et l'Italie, affirmant avoir été insulté avec "des mots très durs". Et a indiqué "ne pas regretter" son geste.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 16:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Mais qu'est-ce qu'il a dit, l'italien?!

― Mädchen (Madchen), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 17:04 (eighteen years ago) link

We'll never know, I bet.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 17:06 (eighteen years ago) link

He didn't say, just mentionned that it concerned the women in his family. He doesn't regret and sai dthat he was a conscious move and not an instinctive rage fit. Between the lines, he pretty much said that he would do it again.

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 17:13 (eighteen years ago) link

He says (very rapid translation, my apologies) - "There were no words with the Italian players before the match. After [it started], as in any match, there are frictions, tension, as there will be during a World Cup final, up to jersey pulling by Materazzi. He grabbed me and I told him to stop and if he liked, I would exchange it with him after the match. And then, he said some very strong words, stronger than a gesture, that he repeated several times. After that, things happened very fast. He said some things that were very grave, very personal which touched me very profoundly, about my mother, my sister. I listened one time, I tried to walk away, and then a second time, a third time. I am human, above all. I would have preferred to take a punch in the mouth rather than to hear that."

"Of course, it's not something one should do and I want to say that loud and clear, I apologize before the millions of children who could see the act, before the educators who teach what to do and what not to do. But I cannot regret this act. That would say that he was right and he cannot be right, absolutely not. What I deplore is that we always penalize the response. But if there is no provocation, there is no response. Do you think that ten minutes before the end of my career, I would have done this for fun? Of course, my act is inexcusable but it's also necessary to penalize the one who is truly guilty. And the guilty one, it's the one who provokes."

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 18:24 (eighteen years ago) link

Also I read allusions to part of the interview where he is pressed by the Canal + presenter to say exactly what it was Materazzi told him, which he won't do, but replies that the lip readers had figured it out. Yes? The direct quotes are from Le Figaro where they ran excerpts, but not the whole interview.

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 18:26 (eighteen years ago) link

He also mentionned this: http://express.lineone.net/sport.html?fSKU=2006-07-11T123619Z_01_L11250229_RTRIDST_0_OUKSP-UK-SOCCER-WORLD-ITALY-RACISM.XML

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 18:38 (eighteen years ago) link

Materazzi has already replied to the interview, denies mentioning Zidane's mother again.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 18:42 (eighteen years ago) link

See the Zidane interview here:

http://videos.tf1.fr/video/sport/alaune/0,,3316341,00.html

(or go to tf1.fr and click on "cliquez ici")

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 18:47 (eighteen years ago) link

(can't get it to work at the moment myself, though, hope you've got more luck)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 18:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Who in the Italian senate said, "We beat a team of blacks, Islamists, and communists"? I expect it was a Fiamma Tricolore, Alleanza Nazionale or Lega Nord memeber.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Why is he wearing a Carhart jacket over his shoulders like a shawl?

― Mary (Mary), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:21 (eighteen years ago) link

daria that is admirably fast translation -

can i just say this?

OMG, SO FRENCH

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Why is he wearing a Carhart jacket over his shoulders like a shawl?

He's le Dieupère. (er... what's The Godfather in French? :-) )

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:30 (eighteen years ago) link

Yup, Roberto Calderoli of la Lega Nord.

Stronzo!

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Jacket over his shoulders: he's Le Parrain, man. (found it!)

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link

I doubt his little military style jacket is Carhart, people.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:33 (eighteen years ago) link

He did another interview on another channel, saying pretty much the same thing, except at one point the interviewer asked
-So you're basically saying that if you had to do it again, you would?
*shrug* -Look, I think I already made myself clear

It was a pretty cool moment

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:37 (eighteen years ago) link

The lovely Emma B has just read it and she's like "what do you mean that's so French?" And I was like, well, in America you'd probably get the guy being "big" and going "if I had the same thing to do over again I would never ever do that, I just hope my family and my fans can eventually find it in their hearts to forgive me" and she's like "but that's so laaaame! In France we're like" and then she gives it the two middle fingers.

― Tracey Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:40 (eighteen years ago) link

Yup, Roberto Calderoli of la Lega Nord.
Stronzo!

Total scum. Amazing to think his party was part of the ruling coalition for the last 5 years.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:50 (eighteen years ago) link

So basically he called his sister a whore. IT'S RACISM GONE WILD.

― Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 19:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Watching TF1 now. haha, he ends lots of sentences with "quoi," which is great. c'etait comme ca quoi ! et voila ! "je serai.. moins surveillé quoi"

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:17 (eighteen years ago) link

meanwhile Greece are back in business

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:20 (eighteen years ago) link

daria, that's so French, quoi.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:22 (eighteen years ago) link

very interesting. the last thing he talks about in the interview is the remarks of the italian senate VP, and how words like that.. fifa saying they are going to combat racism.. words like that are worse, even, than a gesture. it's funny to watch b/c sometimes he says things very matter of factly and then often just trails off like "voila.. draw your own conclusions."

superfrancais. is that canal+ interview on line anywhere?

re: the 'quoi' thing, it's not the most refined way of speaking is it, which is cool - I mean, I do it habitually but then when talking to profs and such realized I had better try and cut back some.

anyway, Zidane rules. I wonder what he's going to do now..

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:27 (eighteen years ago) link

I think Zizou's reaction is kind of a cop out.

"There wouldn't be any reaction without a provocation." OK, then don't react. You're a pro. Practice a couple of icy cool lines about not caring what he says and move on.

I did think he was elegant about saying he didn't know what would have happened had he not been expelled.

The 'quoi' thing is kind of like 'like' in American.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:28 (eighteen years ago) link

A pleonasm.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:29 (eighteen years ago) link

"There wouldn't be any reaction without a provocation."

It's logical! without going off into the realm of what should have happened, clearly what did happen was a reaction ergo there was a provocation.

― dar1a g (daria g), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:34 (eighteen years ago) link

The bloke headbutted someone in front of millions of people, for fuck's sake.

― Vicky (Vicky), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:46 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm merely saying that he owes it to himself, to himself as a professional, to the other 22 players and to the rest of the coaching staff, not to mention his countrymen his family and his fans not to react to so base a provocation. To do so is not only to legitimate the ones he recieved but to show that they can work and encourage future ones.

I'm not saying that FIFA might not want to investigate this behavior, but regardless of the provocation, reaction is not sportsmanlike, whether the provocation is a verbal taunt, a shove, spitting, kicking, or anything else.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:48 (eighteen years ago) link

Count to dix or whatever you have to do, but don't react.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link

I have to disagree. It's human nature to react. I would change the rules to allow retaliation, but only on a like-for-like basis: someone hacks you down, you can kick them back; someone calls you a bad name, you can call them one back. Zidane would still fall foul of this law as he would be applying the wrong retaliation, but the ref could still smooth things over by instructing Materazzi to get up and butt ZZ over while ZZ calls him the son of a filthy terrorist whore.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:53 (eighteen years ago) link

It wasn't related to the game at all, the ball wasn't anywhere near them - ok, this doesn't count as any form of mitigation, but I guess it turned personal the moment Materazzi insulted his family.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:54 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't know anything about how families work in the South of France, but isn't it mediterranean to hold the honour of your family above all else?

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:56 (eighteen years ago) link

It's also 'human nature' to steal, murder, lie, rape, and pillage and while that would make the game slightly more amusing, think of the groundskeepers, ffs. All that gore, sinew, stray eyeballs and worse strewn across the pitch and only a week to clean it up, sell what's redeemable and get the place spic and span for the next match. Couldn't be done.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:58 (eighteen years ago) link

"but the ref could still smooth things over by instructing Materazzi to get up and butt ZZ over while ZZ calls him the son of a filthy terrorist whore"

Haha why do I think this retaliatory system would be rather badly abused pretty quickly!

― Alex in SF (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link

I find that when I hold the honor of my family over people they either get excited, get angry, or giggle.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link

ok, I might have expressed that incorrectly then, you know what I mean.

― StanM (StanM), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 21:13 (eighteen years ago) link

It's perfectly clear what you meant, Stan. I just have a tediously filthy mind.

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 21:15 (eighteen years ago) link

Or should I have said, "L'honneur de ma famille. Je m'en branle'?

― M. White (Miguelito), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 21:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Ha, the latter! Scotland is a European country, but it's inside the UK. Who thinks otherwise?

― David A. (Davant), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 23:44 (eighteen years ago) link

And yes, to whoever was asking, the headbutt to the chest is very unusual, in life as in football.

― David A. (Davant), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 23:46 (eighteen years ago) link

If he'd done that to his face, the groundsman would still be picking up teeth and pieces of Materazzi's lower jaw. In a way, Zidane was actually being very gentle and kind.

― David A. (Davant), Wednesday, 12 July 2006 23:48 (eighteen years ago) link

I say, that was a frightfully silly thing I did, what?

(many x-posts)

― Mädchen (Madchen), Thursday, 13 July 2006 08:37 (eighteen years ago) link

so, nothing new really in his interview. still, it was nice to hear him talk about it (and the whole WC). I really liked when he talked about his penalty kick against italy : "je voulais que ca reste".
classieux.

― AleXTC (AleXTC), Thursday, 13 July 2006 08:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah well, he really made sure "que ça reste"...

― Baaderonixx immer wieder (baaderonixx), Thursday, 13 July 2006 09:05 (eighteen years ago) link

"d'une pierre deux coup", comme on dit !

― AleXTC (AleXTC), Thursday, 13 July 2006 09:09 (eighteen years ago) link

Ha, the latter! Scotland is a European country, but it's inside the UK. Who thinks otherwise?

You'd be surprised. I've encountered (British!) people on this board who have expressed thing along these lines.

Anyway, that's a whole other thread (which we've done already, I believe). As you were...

― ailsa (ailsa), Thursday, 13 July 2006 09:15 (eighteen years ago) link

'I would change the rules to allow retaliation, but only on a like-for-like basis'

Under this excellent system, would ZZ have been allowed to return the nipple-tweak/insult combo with a wedgie and a curse? A sideburn-twist? A chinese burn? How exact must the retribution be before somebody cries 'escalation'?

― Pete W (peterw), Thursday, 13 July 2006 09:46 (eighteen years ago) link

ZZ's comments strike me as profoundly silly. Which is all we can ask for, really.

Has he really retired, completely? He is still listed on the Real Madrid website, together with all the other old fogies.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 13 July 2006 10:21 (eighteen years ago) link

Di Stefano is still on there?

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Thursday, 13 July 2006 10:42 (eighteen years ago) link

I suppose the referee would have to establish parameters for the retribution before it was dished out - obviously the use of video replays would be crucial here.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Thursday, 13 July 2006 10:58 (eighteen years ago) link

NYPD Harsh buzz in Little Italy

― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 13 July 2006 15:13 (eighteen years ago) link

Italian View
French View
Japanese View

http://regmedia.co.uk/2006/07/13/image003.gif
http://regmedia.co.uk/2006/07/13/image002.gif
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/6339/zidane0bv5ks.gif

US View
Hysterical Media view
Gay Wishful thinking view

http://regmedia.co.uk/2006/07/13/image004.gif
http://regmedia.co.uk/2006/07/13/image005.gif
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b281/kangaboy3/ilikeham.gif

Nerd View
Actual View

http://xs303.xs.to/xs303/06283/ZinedineidaneeadbuttSupeario.gif
http://regmedia.co.uk/2006/07/13/image001.gif

― Dave B (daveb), Thursday, 13 July 2006 15:28 (eighteen years ago) link

Kiessling has died.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 13 July 2006 16:48 (eighteen years ago) link

It is funny how the "actual view" is so much better than all the souped up ones.

I wonder if we've seen this bit of film more times than the twin towers footage.

Which twin towers footage? I hear myself cry.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 14 July 2006 07:16 (eighteen years ago) link

It's the ZineZiZapruder footage of today.

― StanM (StanM), Friday, 14 July 2006 07:19 (eighteen years ago) link

It is funny how the "actual view" is so much better than all the souped up ones.

oh i disagree. that Mario one is the best yet.

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Friday, 14 July 2006 08:11 (eighteen years ago) link

I would prefer Zinedine Goes Skiing.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 14 July 2006 08:46 (eighteen years ago) link

but how would you tie that in with the headbutt?

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Friday, 14 July 2006 09:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Another camera angle comes to light (not a joke)

― Dave B (daveb), Friday, 14 July 2006 09:39 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh, that's great. Really - I take it the lipreaders have been at that one?

― ailsa (ailsa), Friday, 14 July 2006 09:43 (eighteen years ago) link

i distinctly saw him say "wanker"

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Friday, 14 July 2006 09:59 (eighteen years ago) link

If nothing else, that new angle disproves my nipple tweaking theory.

― Teh littlest HoBBo (the pirate king), Friday, 14 July 2006 13:33 (eighteen years ago) link

and from yet another angle:

http://www.webpark.ru/uploads29/14_podborka_6.jpg

― StanM (StanM), Saturday, 15 July 2006 10:03 (eighteen years ago) link

Valentino Rossi is wearing a Materazzi shirt. Further comment unnecessary.

― PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Sunday, 16 July 2006 10:29 (eighteen years ago) link

I'd like to think I predicted the final headbutt, here on this very thread, although in fact I called it for an earlier match.

― Ruud Haarvest (Ken L), Monday, 17 July 2006 14:55 (eighteen years ago) link

two weeks pass...

ITALY BREAKS WORLD CUP

― Konal Doddz (blueski), Wednesday, 2 August 2006 10:09 (eighteen years ago) link

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