any other phoebe bridgers haters out there?

tbh i find her and her music absolutely insufferable. motion sickness is a serious contender for the most overrated song of the last decade. i think her lyrics are trite, her production is boring, her voice is generic, her stage schtick is pretentious, her twitter presence is smug and sanctimonious (even though i agree with the vast majority of her opinions)... i just really don't understand the appeal. people compare her to elliott smith and while i know she's a superfan she just lacks everything i love about him.

any other haters out there? everyone seems to adore her and i just do not get it

Welcome to I Love Music

she's basic as hell and i've never enjoyed any song she's made, but i don't see what makes her stand out particularly among her cohort. i kind of assume that when we're through this moment in pop she won't be recalled with a great deal of collective adulation, but unlike certain others (well, one in particular) she's quite easy to avoid

Welcome to I Love Music

― you're a sick man, Buddy Rich (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 15 August 2023 11:45 (ten minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

did you mean this as in "join the club" or more just cause this is my first post? either way, thanks :)

gauchely unfiltered enthusiasm? get ready for some madnessssss!!!!! ;-)

she's basic as hell and i've never enjoyed any song she's made, but i don't see what makes her stand out particularly among her cohort. i kind of assume that when we're through this moment in pop she won't be recalled with a great deal of collective adulation, but unlike certain others (well, one in particular) she's quite easy to avoid

― imago, Tuesday, 15 August 2023 11:49 (eight minutes ago)

to be honest I don't know - I feel like her star has risen so rapidly and she probably has a few more pitchfork-bait albums in her. i suspect she'll be widely adored for a pretty long time.

it's weird. i know this is probably an accusation that gets levelled unfairly at a lot of female artists, but i genuinely think she might be an industry plant - how the hell does a deeply average songwriter like her manage to land slots on SNL and collaborate with fucking conor oberst?

then again, she obviously has some kind of appeal. i've known a lot of people whose musical opinions i generally respect who seem to see something really special in her music... i'm well aware i'm in the minority.

here's a nice example of her being profoundly mediocre: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDHhCMPMypM

i admit I like the little bloops in the background, but she's taken an excellent song by an excellent modern songwriter and sucked all the personality out of it. there's something so... corny and commercial about her singing style.

the little bloops are a slightly irksome choice there i'd say, along with the treated backing vocals. this sort of light hypnagogia that gestures at the psychedelic without achieving it is all over pop production atm. granted, some do it better than others (the 1975 for example are weirdly quite good at making it work, there's pathos to be wrung from it)

sorry this is a big digression from your main point

also using phrases like 'industry plant' with a straight face doesn't get you very far around here, i would advise, but reading her wikipedia page, one might be forgiven for raising an eyebrow at a few points (the words 'Apple commercial' just materialising right there at the start of it all, for example)

not at all! my main point is just "pb sucks lmao" and i've already said all i really have to say about her

even though i like the bloops i totally get what you mean. for an artist that seems to appeal to the exact same audience as so many bedroom folk/pop-adjacent artists (big thief, alex g etc) there's such a lack of anything raw-sounding in her music. i've always compared the way she sings to, like, elsa from frozen or something - technically proficient but really melodramatic and totally uninteresting

also using phrases like 'industry plant' with a straight face doesn't get you very far around here, i would advise, but reading her wikipedia page, one might be forgiven for raising an eyebrow at a few points (the words 'Apple commercial' just materialising right there at the start of it all, for example)

yeah, i guess i don't really believe it. i know she's not a nepo baby and she's been playing live since she was young. maybe it's just that she's got a broad appeal - her music is essentially polished, "cathartic" folk-pop with just enough of a DIY veneer to appeal to the kool kids

i would also say that certainly Big Thief and *maybe* Alex G as well get (rightfully) more recognition for their work on here, although I appreciate you're gunning more for her wider cultural cachet

yeah, it's definitely the her wider fanbase i'm talking about - it makes sense that she'd be rated less highly here since this place is full of people who listen to a LOT of music and can place her in context

When I saw the Barbie movie and the end credits song played, I said "I know this isn't Phoebe Bridgers, but there's this one contemporary singer songwriter I can't ever remember the name of whose songs always make me go WOW this wants to sound like a PB song, and I think it might be her singing"

but it wasn't her, it was Billie Eilish

Hope you stick around to talk about stuff you like. I have found, myself, that articulating why I don’t like an artist helps me figure out and articulate why I like the artists I do like, especially when the artists do something broadly similar. I love late 70s early 80s doomy post-punk but don’t like contemporary acts who try to mimic the same sound— and I figured out that the vast change in recording technology and production and mastering techniques between then and now makes the difference — there’s a lot more depth and space in old analogue low-budget stuff. Modern “rock” recording is so flat and glossy, but I’ve liked contemporary bands performing live where there is a less ability for mixing/postproduction.

I like her a lot, picked up her first album last week but haven't had a chance to listen to it. The production on Punisher is rich, it reminds me of ASMR videos.

Didn't know she was big enough to inspire grievances, but different strokes for different folks.

Has anyone asked Imago what he thinks of Wet Leg yet?

She bored me until boygenius.

At this point I don't know if I hate a lot of music besides right wing nonsense. Maybe it's just me getting old. There's a lot of stuff I don't like, but I don't have enough vitriol to use it on art that doesn't move me.

I remember being Horribly Offended at Liz Phair's commercial moves and being Very Disappointed in her. I recently listened to her 24 Question Party People podcast with Yasi Salek and I was struck by how pleasant she seemed, and that she's just a human being making the music that she wants to make and that's good. It's pretty easy to not listen to things, I don't know why I ever got wound up about stuff like that.

Hope you stick around to talk about stuff you like. I have found, myself, that articulating why I don’t like an artist helps me figure out and articulate why I like the artists I do like, especially when the artists do something broadly similar. I love late 70s early 80s doomy post-punk but don’t like contemporary acts who try to mimic the same sound— and I figured out that the vast change in recording technology and production and mastering techniques between then and now makes the difference — there’s a lot more depth and space in old analogue low-budget stuff. Modern “rock” recording is so flat and glossy, but I’ve liked contemporary bands performing live where there is a less ability for mixing/postproduction.

― Chevy Chase drumming mystery (Boring, Maryland), Tuesday, 15 August 2023 12:09 (one hour ago)

decided to make a new account since i like using my name as a username - this is the poster formerly known as Hospital Radio :)

i really like this attitude! kind of a "via negativa" thing. i have many, many, many bands that i could (and will) enthuse about till the cows come home, but something in me derives a weird pleasure from talking shit.

a youtuber i really like called big joel made a video called something like "in defence of being a hater" where he talks about how talking shit can actually be really interesting - something about how it's easier to have an interesting discussion about negative opinions than positive ones. idk about that though. i just like being a hater sometimes

nobody cares

At this point I don't know if I hate a lot of music besides right wing nonsense. Maybe it's just me getting old. There's a lot of stuff I don't like, but I don't have enough vitriol to use it on art that doesn't move me.

I remember being Horribly Offended at Liz Phair's commercial moves and being Very Disappointed in her. I recently listened to her 24 Question Party People podcast with Yasi Salek and I was struck by how pleasant she seemed, and that she's just a human being making the music that she wants to make and that's good. It's pretty easy to not listen to things, I don't know why I ever got wound up about stuff like that.

― Cow_Art, Tuesday, 15 August 2023 13:06 (one hour ago)

i hope one day i can reach this level of tranquility. all this vitriol can't be good for my pineal gland

i'm actually generally very chill IRL so i think maybe all the shittalking i do is kind of an outlet for the parts of me that are unchill. i feel a strange peace wash over me when i extol the crimes against music committed by my pet hates - phoebe bridgers, drake, oasis etc etc

talk about yourself more

talk about yourself more

― brimstead, Tuesday, 15 August 2023 14:12 (one minute ago)

valid tbh, i have talked about myself too much in this thread. there's no need to be nasty though

When I saw the Barbie movie and the end credits song played, I said "I know this isn't Phoebe Bridgers, but there's this one contemporary singer songwriter I can't ever remember the name of whose songs always make me go WOW this wants to sound like a PB song, and I think it might be her singing"

but it wasn't her, it was Billie Eilish

― The king of the demo (bernard snowy), Tuesday, 15 August 2023 12:08 (two hours ago)

i missed this somehow, all i remember is the one with nicki minaj and ice spice

how the hell does a deeply average songwriter like her manage to land slots on SNL and collaborate with fucking conor oberst

these are just incredibly funny benchmarks. if you're a troll/sock, congrats. if not, good luck.

i feel like i've made kind of an asshole out of myself on this thread. it's been a long time since i posted on a forum and i have no idea why i decided to introduce myself with something so pointlessly inflammatory! sorry everyone!

please just don’t say “nepo baby” ever again, and all is forgiven

noted <3

i feel like i've made kind of an asshole out of myself on this thread. it's been a long time since i posted on a forum and i have no idea why i decided to introduce myself with something so pointlessly inflammatory! sorry everyone!

― milo, Tuesday, 15 August 2023 14:23 (one minute ago) bookmarkflaglink

oh god not at all. you're extremely welcome here and it's great to have new posters. you've conducted yourself perfectly reasonably (with morrisp's caveat haha) and please just ignore brimstead's curmudgeonly cant

17 years ago someone else rocked up bright-eyed and bushy-tailed and proceeded to be at a conservative estimate 40x more annoying than you. they're still here for some reason

it did feel a little curmugeonly but brimstead did kind of have a point. i was talking about myself too much and criticising that is valid. i'm just not a fan of being spoken to that way.

but i appreciate it! it seems like a lovely community and that's something i've sorely missed

17 years ago someone else rocked up bright-eyed and bushy-tailed and proceeded to be at a conservative estimate 40x more annoying than you. they're still here for some reason

― imago, Tuesday, 15 August 2023 14:26 (one minute ago)

i would love to know more about this

oh god

I don't know poster Hospital Radio / milo at all but I welcome them and their musing reaction against a perceived consensus. I agree that there's a consensus and it's sometimes good to resist it. I partly share the poster's feelings, even while thinking ms Bridgers is OK and probably even quite talented. It's true that this particular consensus isn't very oppressive or harmful, but it's all only aesthetics anyway - I think it's fine to think out loud about irritation with it. Poster HR / milo seems like quite a nice, friendly person. Good luck to them. I hope this may be the right attitude.

I don't know, imago. What I see is a dude who decided to make his introductory thread one that shits on a woman he doesn't like. And because he doesn't like her, she must be a fake manufactured product, otherwise how would she possibly get to collaborate with the genius that is *checks notes* Conor Oberst, hmmmm?

(I say this as someone who also doesn't care for Phoebe Bridgers and does agree with Boring's sentiment about articulating stuff you don't like being important... just, very hmmm about this as an opening position for a poster.)

We're knee deep in shitty post-Sheeran male singer songwriters over here, how come no-one ever accuses them of being industry plants?

I don't know, imago. What I see is a dude who decided to make his introductory thread one that shits on a woman he doesn't like. And because he doesn't like her, she must be a fake manufactured product, otherwise how would she possibly get to collaborate with the genius that is *checks notes* Conor Oberst, hmmmm?

(I say this as someone who also doesn't care for Phoebe Bridgers and does agree with Boring's sentiment about articulating stuff you don't like being important... just, very hmmm about this as an opening position for a poster.)

― emil.y, Tuesday, 15 August 2023 14:32 (four minutes ago)

this is completely fair tbh. i really regret that i started my time here with something so abrasive. i don't really have an excuse and wish i'd opened with, like, literally anything else.

just to be clear I really don't think conor oberst is a genius and i don't care for his music. i was just using her collaborating with such a widely beloved artist as an example of how far she's risen.

anyway, there are enough misogynists talking shit about female artists on the internet and i never want to add to that. i'm sincerely sorry

We're knee deep in shitty post-Sheeran male singer songwriters over here, how come no-one ever accuses them of being industry plants?

― Monthly Python (Tom D.), Tuesday, 15 August 2023 14:43 (forty-one seconds ago)

very good point, since many of them definitely are!

just to be clear I really don't think conor oberst is a genius and i don't care for his music. i was just using her collaborating with such a widely beloved artist as an example of how far she's risen.

I do find it funny to cite Oberst as a 2023 high standard of collaboration and not, like, Taylor Swift.

Not sure how being an "industry plants" works tbh.

fwiw we have an existing thread for this kind of drive-by deprecation: thread to dis hyped releases that you don't get/don't like/wanna complain about

I'm not the board mayor, but personally I would rather not have a bunch of specific anti-artist threads on ILM. this place is quiet enough as it is, and it would be demoralizing to start seeing threads like "the thread where we say [rob's favourite artist] sucks." I'm pretty sure I would finally bail on this place if that happened.

anyway, I know that's a moderate overreaction, but it's where my mind went seeing this thread

One of my first ILM appearances was to praise the Stones' Dirty Work.

I don't know that album, but I sincerely think ILM is at its best when it gets me to read a whole thread of praise & analysis of something I don't (initially) like

Burna Boy: A Critical Reevaluation. Why Burn Things?

there are a lot of artists i don't particularly care for who are beloved by many, many people, and i don't spend my time joining message boards and starting threads calling them (or their music):

- insufferable
- overrated
- trite
- boring
- generic
- pretentious
- smug
- sanctimonious

and looking to connect with their "haters"

ymmv, of course

apology aside, it's a terrible look and a terrible first impression ... if this is even a "real" post representing genuine feelings held by someone who loves music ... which i'm not positive it is

i fully intend to make a thread about how hyped/trepidatious i am about the upcoming sparklehorse record when i get home from work - would love to know if anyone else is excited for it. the response to this thread has been kind of an eye-opener to me. being smug and confrontational doesn't make you many friends

also, change your name

something about how it's easier to have an interesting discussion about negative opinions than positive ones

been on ilm long enough to know this isn't true

Burna Boy: A Critical Reevaluation. Why Burn Things?

― imago, Tuesday, August 15, 2023 11:01 AM (three minutes ago)

lol, but the BB thread has lots of critical & divergent opinions! ftr I absolutely don't want unadulterated stanning either

apology aside, it's a terrible look and a terrible first impression ... if this is even a "real" post representing genuine feelings held by someone who loves music ... which i'm not positive it is

― alpine static, Tuesday, 15 August 2023 15:02 (two minutes ago)

unfortunately, it is real. i think i just really misread the room and completely misunderstood the vibe of this forum. wish i could just delete the fuckin thing to be honest!

milo how do you feel about the word “woke”?

do you prefer rap with or without braggadocio?

Ban Hospital Radio

phoebe bridgers is a great songwriter. i don't really care for her fans or social media following either, but no one with ears can deny "funeral."

i will say to you milo, if that is your real name and you are a real person, don't bother trying to win the approval of the people in this forum. it's my online home, but it's a den of wolves and it is not a place where people assume the best about you.

also milo, what are your thoughts on trucker hats and forming babby?

like i disagree with the premise of this thread, but i don't want to see someone torn to shreds and dragged through the streets of troy

did that happen?

troyship

“i don't really care for her fans or social media following either,” this is true of almost everyone now. I can’t even look at LDR fans responses to things, it makes me cringe.

did that happen?

― rob, Tuesday, August 15, 2023 3:30 PM (four minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

yes they killed hospital radio, gloated about it, and now this new guy milo gets in and they are doing the same thing to him, all the while making him apologize

ok lol

do you prefer rap with or without braggadocio?

Maybe he's really into dark mid-tempo kinda spooky hip hop talking about death and darkness and other night kinda shit.

give me an example

I cosign nothing in this thread particularly the Steely Dan fandom.

Thread should have been titled Stinky Bridgers

Boydummy

I claimed Boregenius™ in the complain-about-hype thread; happy to offer a license for use of that term elsewhere

Boygenies

Boygenus ethnological studies of Kyles and Chad in verse

I don't really like Phoebe Bridgers but I can't really get worked up about it

also there's a new sparklehorse thing coming out???

oh she was really mean to the crew on this in-studio session she did my friend worked on, usually a bad sign how you treat people under you in my experience

I did really like "motion sickness", great song

What happened there?

With her level of exposure as the new indie rock super star it's almost impossible to not come off as disagreeable to people who aren't struck by her music. Even the idea of this thread is boring because it's so obvious a lot of people are loudly part of a backlash.

I ranked her debut album as my fave of that decade, I don't think anything since has hit me as much but I still like her music a lot, and I choose to not consume too much coverage or opinions about her because even as a fan the discourse and exposure would be exhausting.

xpost - just berating everyone on the staff and her band

play slower!!!

I used to get annoyed when people I knew were into an artist whose music didn't resonate with me. In some cases, I may have *wanted* to connect with the music so I could share in their enthusiasm, but was frustrated that I couldn't. But grappling with it was sort of fun in any case, because I liked when I felt strongly enough about something to argue about it.

These days, in my 40s, music plays so little of a role in my social relationships that I don't even have an opportunity to develop these kinds of feelings. I sometimes feel a little alienated from a popular or critically acclaimed musician who doesn't move me, but I don't feel *annoyed* in the way I would if a friend raved about them.

As for Phoebe Bridgers, I think "Motion Sickness" is an all-time great song, and I like the rest of her first album well enough, though I found the follow-up kind of disappointing. I might be bothered by the fact that the second one got so much more hype, but literally nobody I know IRL (other than my wife) is listening to Phoebe Bridgers. Or at least they're not talking to me about her.

lol voodoo

No longer having strong negative feelings about music I don't like has been so freeing. Friends of mine have really fallen into a poptimist hole and I could never really get on board with that sound overall, so the worst thing that happens is that I can be bored by the music they talk about with enthusiasm so therefore need to work harder to feign interest (not that I'm not engaged with their enthusiasm and opinions, but my indifference to the material means that I need to force it a bit). Likewise, they're rarely moved by my enthusiasm for my deep dives into experimental and/or "classic" indiepop / post-punk from the late 80s / early 90s.

I do remember having that sort of frustration with the appeal of music I found sounded generic, or had other uninteresting lowest common denominator attributes to the production / presentation and all the cynical conspiratorial ideas I had about the intentional marketing decisions that I believed were carefully driving the design of those attributes. I've moved past it, even if in the back of my mind I still wonder about it case by case. All that kind of ire these these days is aimed at, say, the influence of popular Twitter(X) accounts on people's worldviews, the way reality shows and clickbait make people dumber, stuff like that.

I’m impressed at how zen you all are about mid music in your old age

Not really a pheobe bridgers fan myself

Enjoy that there’s a space on ilx to say so. It does feel omnipresent in a way that feels out of step with how “I guess?” The music is

surely there is ample room to voice our displeasure on the internet, but it would be cooler if it was used to gather and share around things we love

I don't know if that is zen exactly, but I don't see the use in bonding over our shared disinterest

to that end I can say that I really like boygenius and wish other singer/songwriters would band together to make more interesting bands

I think generally it's more constructive, in a situation like this where there is clearly a huge fanbase who absolutely adore an artists music, to try and figure out what the appeal is rather than write it off as though everyone should find it unappealing. Sure, it's not for you and that's cool. But I think it's way more interesting to figure it's appeal out than trash it.

this is a real old ilm thread and I mean that in the most insulting way

hey guys - i made this post with a different username and now really wish i hadn't. it's a big ugly stain on what seems to otherwise be a chill, welcoming space full of mature people with interesting and diverse tastes. i'm considering asking for it to be deleted but first i just wanted to make clear that i don't actually stand by it and think i was being really stupid and childish when i made it. how would you guys feel about me getting it wiped?

Seems like a bizarre overreaction to me

i dont think its that big a deal, making a dumb post/thread is practically a rite of passage for forums like this, everyone here's got one somewhere in the database

I don't think it needs deleting; fbow, there are some interesting posts about negativity here now and there are way worse threads in the archives that still get bumped from time to time

it is funny that you keep posting "hi, I'm the guy who made the bad thread"
(I honestly mean that affectionately)

wouldn't worry about it - absolute rite of passage here.

i reckon there's a difference between just making a dumb post/thread and posting something combative and vitriolic. as alpine static said earlier in the thread, it's a pretty awful first impression to make

doubly so considering i make music under the name Hospital Radio. if i ever release an album or get any kind of fanbase it probably won't serve me well to have mean-spirited shitposts attached to my name

don't really have an explanation as to why i made the post in the first place - i guess i had a bee in my bonnet last week and wasn't really thinking about the consequences of my actions

maybe i'll keep it up though. accountability and all that

it is funny that you keep posting "hi, I'm the guy who made the bad thread"
(I honestly mean that affectionately)

― rob, Tuesday, 22 August 2023 15:36 (eight minutes ago)

i think there's something slightly compulsive about it lmao - this will be the last time, i promise!

doubly so considering i make music under the name Hospital Radio. if i ever release an album or get any kind of fanbase it probably won't serve me well to have mean-spirited shitposts attached to my name

in all seriousness, that is something that has been important for other posters on ilx in the past, so you could ask a mod to help you out if you decide you don't want these posts to haunt you: https://www.ilxor.com/ILX/NewAnswersControllerServlet?boardid=56

she sucks so bad

she doesn't. she writes mostly good and occasionally incredible songs.

She doesn’t suck, it’s worse, she’s boring

everyone here's got one somewhere in the database

― ciderpress, Tuesday, 22 August 2023 15:34 (yesterday) bookmarkflaglink

'one', lol

retitle it Stinky Bridgers and everything's fine

from the twisted mind of H.R. Milo

Only a matter of time before someone forms a band called Stinky Bridgers, and only a little longer after until they put out a single featuring Phoebe Bridgers.

You know, this whole time I thought it was “bridges”. Her stock gets lower to me by the hour