That guy from The Streets is a much better rapper than Roots Manuva

Actually they're both really good - coming from/drawing from very different traditions. The Streets don't connect to Jamaican music like Roots does, Roots doesn't remind me of John Cooper Clarke. British MCing finding a voice was the most exciting thing about 2001 for me - Garage MCing feels fresher and looks better because it can't be compared to the Americans but UK hip-hop MCing offers something different again.

But The Streets = goodness too, although perhaps not the most representative example of a garage MC (apparently his album sounds like The Beta Band in some places and The Specials in others. Bring it on!)

I've been listening to/thinking about garage a lot though lately, and about the MC phenomenon, about how it interrelates with the music. It's interesting how weirdly symbiotic the relationship is between the music and the MC-ing (much more than it ever was in jungle, and the bond is maybe stronger than it is in hip hop right now). If it wasn't for the MCs I think garage would have slid completely into breakbeats by now, but the slinky 2-step beats and supa-fast Brit chatter complement eachother so perfectly that it such a move now seems impossible. The beats are what allow the MCs to shine, because their twists and turns force the MCs to be complete vocal gymnasts - the raps are as fall of sudden stops and sideways swivels as the music, which are just delightful to listen to. It's like how MCs in Jamaica are actually called the Disc Jockeys, because their raps really do have to ride the bucking beats. The increasing narrative complexity of the raps themselves is of course major icing on the cake, but I'd be happy to listen to the MCs purely for the aural delights (it amazes me how few people mention Ms Dynamite in these sorts of conversations - she's utterly brilliant and populist, and "Boo" was the best meta-commentary pop of 2001).

Current favourite MC track: the (relatively) new version of the United Grooves Collective's "Mic Tribute" with the God's Gift crew rapping, ie. all my sentimental favourites: The Unknown MC, PSG etc. who've been brilliant since way back in '98 with Da Click's "Good Rhymes". On this new version of "Mic Tribute" their raps interplay with the labyrinthine beats with the edgy agility of jungle warfare.

Yes, yes, yes. Wonderful stuff.

To veer a little off-topic (and not directly related to garage MCing, or Brit-hop vocalisation - or maybe it is), whatever happened to Bahamadia? I thought her contributions to that Roni Size album were thrilling, and (to my ears) sounded like a new direction d'n'b might take. Perhaps it did, and I'm at fault for not spotting the line from that to what's happening now.

they must be laughing their tits off thinking people actually go out and buy this shit.

I do understand how people have difficulty listening to, say, Braintax (one of my favourite UK rappers for years now) but it sounds great to me. Similarly Lewis Parker, whose MCing I adore, Scor-Zay- Zee, too, has been making blazing records recently, and sounds so Nottingham you could chop him up and sell the bits as Robin Hood souvenirs. The point being that UK rappers have found voices which don't sound like US rappers: sometimes that sounds odd or unsettling, and I rather like it.

As far as 'unneccessary', has any genre at any time been necessary? There are some startlingly good and original UK hip hop records being made right now (along with many very ordinary ones, no question). That's all a genre needs to stop itself being obsolete isn't it?

I suspect there is a greater mobility of MCs between the UKG / UK hip hop / dancehall scenes than some of the posts in this thread are suggesting.

Having said all of that, I'm not any kind of an expert on the best MCs in UKG: who should I be looking out for?

Y'see?

i like the guy who thought that the streets popularity was purely down to the nme championing it. wasnt in all the shops a good half a year before it got in the charts or anything.....

If you call yourself The Streets and you rap about the Friday night post-curry fight, you'd better be in on the joke.

"Geezers Need Excitement" is doing the same sort of thing as The Specials' "Friday Night And Saturday Morning" surely?

I'm not sure why (should listen to the tune again, I suppose), but something about "Geezers" almost immediately made me wonder if it was conscious or unconscious self-parody. (I liked the other side, or at least the acappela the Stanton Warriors used, without any need for irony). Something to do with the accent, maybe. He seems like he's trying very hard to sound, for want of a better word, working class. And then the narrative was just too much... Like I say, if it's parody, it's great, if not, sad.

I haven't listened to the Specials in ages, but I guess they always felt a bit more believable, basically. There was usually a morbid undercurrent to their lyrics. Plus they didn't have cod-Cockney accents.

a) be a good actor (Mobb Deep, Jay-Z) b) maintain ironic distance (Rolling Stones country 'n' western songs)

If you can find it, particularly listen to "Too Much Brandy", which apart from being a fabulous monsta-groove, has the most appallingly funny drug stories EVAH! Cocaine-pushin' GEEZERS and everyfink!

its still annoying/bizarre/disgusting to me how skinner is regarded as an 'MC'.

disgusting is what it is.

http://fightphotos.com/boxextras/images/etc3.jpg

much as i love his voice, and 'witness', and the ideas in his production (although a lot of his beats could do with a bit more power) roots manuva, while obviously better than the streets, isnt a very good mc either is he? he seems very sloppy on the whole.

not really

better than lotek hifi, and ty, and new flesh though.

"Oh U Want More?" > anything The Streets ever recorded

Manuva is still one of my favourite rappers, despite the fact that sometimes i feel he lets his sexy voice do a lot of the work rather than working on his flow, he always comes hard on tracks, i dont think anyone could dispute that.

i wouldn't dream of it.

Thats good i think the guy is a manic depressive as well, so i'd not want to knock his confidence!

You know which roots manuva song i love, i just remembered, the one on that newest Gorillaz album, i believe it is called "All Alone".

"Oh You Want More?" is a great tune, but it's true Ty isn't technically that good. Out of the ones I've heard, the British rapper with the best technique has gotta be Blak Twang. Infinite Livez is surprisingly good too, which only proves that being a good rapper doesn't necessarily mean you can make good rap records.

but ty raps like a simpleton.

the british rapper with the best technique right now is durrty goodz.

Stop.

It's actually Lyrican.

Since we're on the subject of British rappers, does anyone know what happened to the three MCs in the group called Brotherhood, which (as far as I know) only released one LP in 1996? They were all quite good, but as far as I know they haven't done anything ever since.

not sure what happened to all of them but shyloc still 'mingles' within the industry i think. goodz' axiom ep is one of the best things ive heard from a uk rapper (grime or ukhh) in a long while...

everyone on skinner's the beats sucks (au natrellement).

Hey, maybe Professor Green will shock us all and drop a great album! (lololololololololololololololololol)

Shyloc, oh yeah, I think he was the best of those three. Has he put out any records after 1996?

And The Streets MC obviously sucks, but I don't think it's fair to compare him proper rappers, he's more in the "spoken word with beats" category with people like Sister Souljah and Saul Williams.

Tuomas, I heard something three or four years ago saying The Brotherhood were recording together again, but I don't recall seeing the products of any reunion.

Before that, well, I seem to recall rumours that it was DJ Dexter doing the scratching for 5ive. Marvellous. No idea whether that's true or not. (Incidentally, they made a mini LP called XIII for Bite It! records as well as their LP for Virgin, and I've never heard it but you see it around from time to time.)

"he's more in the "spoken word with beats" category with people like Sister Souljah and Saul Williams."

you are alone (well barring myself and a few others) in thinking this though. say that to most people and theyll tell you youre being myopic.

"Can't Tell Me Nothing" is wasted on Kanye and would be much better as a Roots Manuva beat.

Why are all these Streets threads getting revived? Who could give a damn?

Someone needs their aerial locking down

Dear KRS-One,

I don't know if you've heard of me but I'm a rapper/producer from South London England and I've just released a record called Run Come Save Me that I thought might be of interest to you. I also just wanted to let you personally know how much that track you did with Shabba Ranks meant to me when I was first starting out. It really opened my eyes to new forms of expression in hip-hop music. Anyway, I've included a copy of my new CD. I'd love it if you'd let me know what you think of it. Thanks!

Sincerely,
Rodney Smith (Roots Manuva)
"The most significant and original new voice in hip-hop..." --The Independent

- - - - -

Manuva,

Don't fucking kid yourself, I know the act. Seems like things are going nice for you right now, and honestly, I'm happy for you. I think you're a good kid. But this new album you sent me, what the fuck? I don't even know where to start on this bullshit. The first track, it's called "No Strings," but actually it's nothing but strings. I guess you think you're doing something very clever here. Rodney, fuck, listen to me: it's just tepid. All of it. You're riding the wave of novelty right now. I didn't rhyme my way out of the motherfucking gutter on NME hype. If you stay on this path your next stop's gonna be a Thievery Corporation cameo. All your reviews begin with, "Where else will you hear someone rapping about [insert Britishism here]?" Who gives a fuck about "ten pints of bitter?" You were never lyrically stunning, to say the very least, but at least you were listenable; now it's like trying to sit through a blunted knock-knock joke with no punchline. To make it all somehow worse, the only real (read: American) MC on the whole thing is that clown from J5 on "Join the Dots," and he's easily the worst lyricist in the history of this rap shit. Namedropping Anthony Kiedis, for fuck's sake, Rodney, that's unforgivable. I dunno, maybe the words would be a bit more palatable if not for your voice. Oh, that voice. Christ. On your first album it seemed like your rugged (yawn) vocal stylings were almost something close to fresh, but now with the production thinned to the most boring minimum (and after hearing too fucking many two-step raga shouters), a weak cockney sputter just doesn't hold my interest at all. Everything on here seems stolen, and not just because the (unintentionally?) shaky religious doubt of "Sinny Sin Sin" comes directly from my On Christian Hypocrisy chapter. You've jumbled all the flaws of every ponderous underground hip-hop animal into a confusingly repulsive (and, lest i forget, British) MC. It's a bad thing.

So your voice is dry, the rhymes are shook ("the return of the Rootical one?" What the fuck?) and, hate to say it, but the beats are worse than ever. A damn shame, too, because your last had some incredible tracks. "Clockwork" was one of the hottest old world moody-style joints of '99 for sure. How did your skills behind the boards slip so bad? It's sad to see the guy who effortlessly floated on the grainy charcoal-sketched Mobb Deep wail of "Movements" driven to the hollow two-note keyboard loops and boring dirgy bass of almost every track here. Grotesque bids at dance cred are strictly 1997. I paid my dues with Goldie already so you can sit the fuck down. Honestly, I can't even believe UK "electronica" culture is coming out for this languid failure anyway. It's certainly no more rewarding in the club than back at home. Here's some production advice: lay off the fucking weed! I borrowed from dub's framework to get hardcore bounce-back, you're just coming off with funkless rewrites of Shaggy's "Boombastic" injected with ill-conceived pretension. At this point, even Wu got you bested on the reggae-rap front and they're just half-heartedly fucking around with it. Better luck next time.

Peace,
KRS

- - - - -

Hi!

Thanks a lot for the correspondence. I love to hear from fans like yourself. Unfortunately, until I get less mail or less work (neither of which I'd welcome!), I can't respond personally to every piece of mail I receive.

We also appreciate your interest in the Roots Manuva Fan Club. However, we could not process your request due to the following error:

�5 not enclosed.

Thanks!

Roots Manuva
"One of the sanest offerings to emerge from the British inner city and a healthy antidote to the inanity of US hip hop" --The Daily Telegraph

sfts, e. coldblooded.

Here's some production advice: lay off the fucking weed!

Perhaps Roots's suicide attempt and ongoing battle with severe mental health issues could have been avoided if he'd checked this one?

^ tru

Early 00s Pitchfork hip-hop reviewers: here to help

"the production thinned to the most boring minimum"

but this seems to be a big dada pre-requisite (not including their american signings like spank rock, majesticons obviously). see: lo-tek hifi, some ty, etc etc.

where's that KRS-One thing from? mentalist

From an old Breihan review.