BEST EVER JAZZ ALBUM (from rateyourmusic.com) redone.

WOW a lot of great albums on this list. For me, tho: Miles Davis' In A Silent Way.

― Daniel, Esq., Sunday, 4 October 2009 01:38 (17 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Krzysztof Komeda Astigmatic (1966)

the only one i don't own / haven't heard

― moonship journey to baja, Sunday, 4 October 2009 01:55 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Don't know it either.

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 01:55 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

CTRL+F "basie" not found
CTRL+F "armstrong" not found
CTRL+F "billie" not found

probably voting my favorite things or far east suite but RYM users up on some bullshit imo

― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:00 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I could probably go on these 50 records for quite a good while, if I had to just listen to this list. There seem to be six I haven't heard.

― earlnash, Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:01 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

There's no Charlie Parker on there either, so yeah, it isn't complete by any stretch. It is really more about when the LP took over from the 78 in the late 50s into the golden period of jazz LPs into the late 60s, which is probably what they are trying to get at I would think.

― earlnash, Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:03 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

voted Olé Coltrane for the sublime title track.

20 others tied for second :)

― nicky lo-fi, Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:03 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

billie holiday is at 68

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:08 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

http://rateyourmusic.com/customchart?page=1&chart_type=top&type=album&year=alltime&genre_include=1&genres=jazz&include=both&origin_countries=&limit=none&countries=

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:08 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

80 Charlie Parker & Dizzy Gillespie Bird and Diz (1952)

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:09 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

There's no Charlie Parker on there either, so yeah, it isn't complete by any stretch. It is really more about when the LP took over from the 78 in the late 50s into the golden period of jazz LPs into the late 60s, which is probably what they are trying to get at I would think.

I guess, but I mean...there's a strong tradition of song in jazz. An awesome tradition. Totally unrepresented on the list, you'd think from this list that no jazz vocalist had ever made a great album. Like, The Audience With Betty Carter, maybe? Or Lady in Satin, I know not everybody can get down w/those arrangements but Billie did a bunch of records on Verve that I can listen to front to back happily for weeks. Or Nat King Cole. Or Carmen McRae.

― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:09 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

121 Count Basie Basie (1957)

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:10 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

herman I know you'll join me in saying that there's at least one Basie record that's better than
Cowboy Bebop by the Seatbelts (#58)

― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:14 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i have never heard it, nor do i watch anime, but im sure theres a lot of albums on that list thats better than that!

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:39 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ive checked out the top 200 and theres some awesome albums in that.

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:41 (16 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

herman I know you'll join me in saying that there's at least one Basie record that's better than
Cowboy Bebop by the Seatbelts (#58)

baaaaaaarf

internet users are the biggest savages imo

― moonship journey to baja, Sunday, 4 October 2009 02:54 (15 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

okay i'm a novice but i bought kind of blue about 10 years ago when i was about 14 and every single electric miles record which i've got into in the last year or so makes my head spin 10,000 more rapidly...

― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, 4 October 2009 03:48 (14 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

10.000 times...

― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, 4 October 2009 03:48 (14 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

stating that yr not THAT impressed by kind of blue is one of the biggest possible challops

― xhuxk mangione (deej), Sunday, 4 October 2009 04:00 (14 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

It's a bit strange to me that the only Bill Evans in the top 50 is Explorations. Is this a studio-album only thing? Because I'd think Sunday at the Village Vanguard or Waltz for Debby would make more sense.

― Bay-L.A. Bar Talk (Hurting 2), Sunday, 4 October 2009 04:04 (14 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

No Weather Report, "Head Hunters" or "Future Shock" no credibility.
Voted "Kind Of Blue" though.

― Tied Up In Geir (Geir Hongro), Sunday, 4 October 2009 12:24 (6 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Many wonderful records there, but...

No AYLER? Spiritual Unity and Live At Greenwich Village are essential surely?

No Pharoah Sanders? No Brotzmann? No William Parker? No David S Ware? No Dark Magus or Get Up With It? Only one Ornette? No Elevator Over The Hill? No Liberation Music Orchestra? No Evan Parker? No Braxton? No Bailey? No Don Cherry? No Joe McPhee? No Brotherhood of Breath?

Early jazz is poorly represented too. I guess that's due to the lack of classic totemic albums or standardised collections.

Headhunters: nowhere as good as Sextant, which is much funkier, weirder and cosmic.

― Stew, Sunday, 4 October 2009 12:53 (5 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Headhunters has tunes. That is important. Sextant is just weird.

― Tied Up In Geir (Geir Hongro), Sunday, 4 October 2009 13:03 (5 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I have such crappy indie-rock taste in jazz. My favourites of these 50 are In A Silent Way and Journey In Satchidananda. I've only heard about 10 of the others though.

― Tim F, Sunday, 4 October 2009 13:12 (5 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

stating that yr not THAT impressed by kind of blue is one of the biggest possible challops

is it? i'm not trying to be controversial...it's just what I think.

― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, 4 October 2009 13:13 (5 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Deej means it's a cliche. Or at least it's very typical for people conditioned on modern rock/pop/etc. to check out Kind of Blue, be underwhelmed, then gravitate towards electric miles.

I described my taste in jazz as "crappy indie-rock" for similar reasons.

― Tim F, Sunday, 4 October 2009 13:20 (5 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Out to Lunch! v. Olé Coltrane v. Journey in Satchidananda v. Juju - Dunno what I am going to pick.

Kind of Blue is kind of boring, sorry.

― I'M LEGALLY A MIDGET (a hoy hoy), Sunday, 4 October 2009 13:36 (5 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ah okay right I didn't get he meant it in that way. yeah possibly. nail me to the challop cross!

― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, 4 October 2009 13:49 (4 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

a love supreme. it's something of a cliche to claim that as the best jazz album of all time, but for good reason.

mingus ah um, in a silent way, ascension and shape of jazz to come just bringing up the rear.

― m the g, Sunday, 4 October 2009 15:12 (3 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

it's a great list, tho. i've heard maybe half of these, i think. voting for Monk '56.

― a single man owns you (Ioannis), Sunday, 4 October 2009 15:49 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

"kind of blue is boring" = "i have ADD"

― hope this helps (Granny Dainger), Sunday, 4 October 2009 15:53 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Writing off "Kind Of Blue" is just as pointless as writing off "Sgt. Pepper".

― Tied Up In Geir (Geir Hongro), Sunday, 4 October 2009 16:00 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Geir Hongro telling people about jazz.

It's absolutely not like writing off Sgt. Pepper. Most people buy Kind Of Blue and if they decide they don't like it will never buy another jazz album. Other than lex, who else would write off a whole genre on account of disliking Sgt. Pepper?

Miles has done more enjoyable and more challanging records and I'm guessing the folks on here who are bringing the KofB challops know that.

― I'M LEGALLY A MIDGET (a hoy hoy), Sunday, 4 October 2009 16:07 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Well, my point is that, well, "A Kind Of Blue" is obviously the most famous jazz record of all time and also generally acclaimed, not least among those of us who are not jazz fans. I know some purists tend to dislike anything that is liked by non-jazz-fans, and they may find it "boring" for that reason, just like some stupid people will write off "Sgt. Pepper" just because it's famous and, well, popular with the baby boomers.

But I still consider it pointless on both accounts. Both albums are obviously very essential.

― Tied Up In Geir (Geir Hongro), Sunday, 4 October 2009 16:26 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

more enjoyable

I enjoy KoB as much as any Miles record.

more challanging

not something I really look for or like in music.

― hope this helps (Granny Dainger), Sunday, 4 October 2009 16:33 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Kind Of Blue is great even if i prefer a dozen or more miles albums. Sgt Peppers, 2 great songs aside, is not very good at best.

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 16:44 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I never said it was a bad album. I like it; just not enough to ever think to pull it often.

― I'M LEGALLY A MIDGET (a hoy hoy), Sunday, 4 October 2009 16:55 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

alot of jazz albums on rym are listed under subgenres of jazz (free jazz, avant-garde jazz, vocal jazz, etc) and won't show up on the list linked.

try this list instead:
http://rateyourmusic.com/customchart?page=1&chart_type=top&type=album&year=alltime&genre_include=1&genres=jazz&include_child_genres=t&include=both&origin_countries=&limit=none&countries=

― nil!, Sunday, 4 October 2009 16:57 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

also, rym's ranking algorith boosts albums with more votes. vocal jazz or jazz standard records tend to be less popular on rym, and many don't garner enough votes to crack the top 100 despite a gaudy rating avg.

― nil!, Sunday, 4 October 2009 17:04 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

" Suggest Ban Permalink

Writing off "Kind Of Blue" is just as pointless as writing off "Sgt. Pepper"."

They're both wildly over-rated. The difference is that KoB is still pretty decent.

While a lot of my favorites aren't on here (which is kind of ILX kabuki to immediately mention whatever's not on the list), there's enough strong stuff that I would nominate unprompted that I don't feel particularly constrained in my voting.

I think the list also shows how much jazz kicked rock's ass in the '60s.

― Giorgio Marauder (I eat cannibals), Sunday, 4 October 2009 17:14 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

ok who wants this poll to be locked and use the http://rateyourmusic.com/customchart?page=1&chart_type=top&type=album&year=alltime&genre_include=1&genres=jazz&include_child_genres=t&include=both&origin_countries=&limit=none&countries= list instead?

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 17:25 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

(without the zappa album btw)

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 17:25 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I don't mind mayne. What does 'Ascension' sound like btw? After the football I may give it a listen.

― I'M LEGALLY A MIDGET (a hoy hoy), Sunday, 4 October 2009 17:30 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

first word that comes to mind when i think of Ascension is "density". the playing is wonderful. i really need to be in the right mood, and there's no way to absorb it in one listen. but if you like free form jazz, i think it's the pinnacle

― outdoor_miner, Sunday, 4 October 2009 17:43 (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

maybe what i wrote about <a href="http://musik.antville.org/stories/1236915/";;>ascension</a>, my fave album from 1965, a while ago in my old blog may give an idea about how it sounds:

<q>... Ascension surely is a challenging listen but it is by no means cacophony. There even is a structure in the 40 minutes piece. In between the ensembles almost everyone has got a solo and the others provide a background "carpet of sound" (Klangteppich). I get the impression that the collective lifts up the soloist who slowly emerges from the crowd, stands in the centre for two to three minutes and then returns back into the womb of the band after. Especially the overblown sax solos are outbursts of pure energy. Altogether a perfect equilibrium of the community and the individual. In this sense Ascension does not only stand for a spiritual experience but also for a shared experience. ...</q>

― alex in mainhattan, Sunday, 4 October 2009 18:08 (38 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I think the thing is with kind of blue is that on first listen, to modern ears, it's nice, somewhat unobtrusive...and almost cheesy. if what got you into jazz was wild playing and high-energy improvisation (hello!) then it's going to seem like boring dinner jazz. I can totally understand why someone wouldn't like it.

don't get me wrong, it's a fantastic album, and I love it madly...now. but not not at first. its charms are subtle, and may require a bit of historical context before they reveal themselves.

I think the list also shows how much jazz kicked rock's ass in the '60s.

absolutely.

― m the g, Sunday, 4 October 2009 18:25 (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

A lot of people think real jazz is boring bland dinner/coffee table jazz (sometimes with vocals) and the stuf ilm likes they would hate. Probably on some other board right now that stuff is in another poll and later coltrane/davis etc is hated.

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 18:27 (18 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Anyone who has Spotify should find most of these albums on it easily. So enjoy!

― pfunkboy (Herman G. Neuname), Sunday, 4 October 2009 18:31 (14 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

For me is between Mingus' 'Black Saint' and Yusef Lateef's 'eastern sounds'.

― Moka, Sunday, 4 October 2009 18:44 (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Well, now I can't vote Yusef Lateef so I guess Mingus is the one to get my vote.

and sorry j0hn d for this poll still not having what you want. Maybe you want to run a vocal jazz poll?

ahh sorry moka.

I guess there's always going to be something missing that people like. Cant cater for everyone.

Now there's "Head Hunters" at least. :)

Including child genders is often very important at RYM. :)

well, it's not a site i'm familiar with really. Only ever looked at it really when its been linked to from here. I think I may have done a poll based on its lists before so thanks for the tip about child genres.

Weirded out by ppl finding KoB hard to understand/relate to/appreciate on 1st listen. Agree that Bitches Brew/Dark Magus electric Miles is much rawer, weirder, more psychedelic & rock, but I'm with Geir here: KoB is one of the most immediately and obviously appealing records I've ever heard. Up there with Sgt. Peppers, as he says, and that comparison doesn't bother me at all. It's a great list, overall, especially when you consider that it represents a blind, broad consensus formed without the intent to create such a list.

Voted Money Jungle, strictly for perversity's sake.

"if what got you into jazz was wild playing and high-energy improvisation (hello!) then it's going to seem like boring dinner jazz."

Yeah, and I definitely came at it from that point of view. I mean, it's one of those albums that I like, but it just doesn't captivate me the way that most everything that came after it does. But, by way of copping to biases, I also hate the vast majority of vocal jazz, and I don't like ballads pretty much regardless of the genre, but ballads with vocals are worse. Most of vocal jazz or (as John put it) the "song tradition" of jazz, I think is more interesting as pop than as jazz, and so it's not something that I reach for when I want jazz. Like, St. James Infirmary is one of my favorite songs in the history of ever, but while I realize it's connected to the history of jazz, it's something I think of first as itself, then as jazz, rather than jazz first.

I realize that's all convoluted, but jazz is convoluted too.

It was pretty easy for me to vote for Journey in Satchidananda in the previous poll, but now that Karma is on the list too, man it's difficult to choose between those two.

I voted Karma, Tuomas (the main reason i did the repoll tbh)

but it was a tough choice.
Again it annoys me when so many of these albums get left off so called best album ever lists just "because its jazz".

"Weirded out by ppl finding KoB hard to understand/relate to/appreciate on 1st listen."

I think that's actually a mark against it for a lot of listeners—it's really easy to appreciate without thinking about it. There's a lot more going on that's worth thinking about, but it's not like, say, Sun Ship, where from the first you're like, Ok, I'm going to have to pay attention because this is not going to be easy. Which is another reason why I tend to think of KoB as a pop album—immediate, catchy, "easy listening." I'm not against pop music, and I think that KoB has a lot going on, but it's also really easy to ignore all that, and for me at least, to tune it out. Especially since it's one of the most overplayed jazz albums in history. It was playing softly at the Albertson's last weekend, and it was like, y'know, there's no way to give this the attention it deserves.

People who love Karma, you gotta listen to the version of "The Creator Has a Master Plan" by Louis Armstrong. Yes, there really is a Louis Armstrong version! It's a duet between Armstrong and Leon Thomas, I think they were on the same label around the time it was recorded. It's not perfect song in any way, Armstrong sounds like he's just ad libbing through the whole song, and it ends too quickly, but it's still fun to hear Satchmo tackle "The Creator Has a Master Plan". Thomas's solo version of the tune is nice too, I think it's kinda too short as well, but you get to hear verses whose lyrics were printed on the liner notes of Karma, even though Thomas only sings the chorus on that version.

it's really easy to appreciate without thinking about it.

well, not really... it's all about your perspective and your usual listening habits, isn't it? those who are melodically/harmonically-minded will warm to KoB immediately but might find dark magus 'challenging'. my own default setting is noise and chaos and speed and harshness, so I'm exactly the other way around.

surely 'challenging' is all a matter of what you're used to, not a quality inherent in the music itself?

Agree that Albertsons is not the ideal environment for deep listening.

for god's sake don't restart this poll again, man, but Herbie Hancock Empyrean Isles (1964) is in there twice (#35 & #40).

Did somebody upthread sneer at this list for not including Peter fucking Brötzmann?

take it to RYM

Did somebody upthread sneer at this list for not including Peter fucking Brötzmann?

yes, and rightly so.

as is Miles Smiles xxxp

and sorry j0hn d for this poll still not having what you want. Maybe you want to run a vocal jazz poll?

I'm not mad or nothin! really more excited for an interesting discussion, for real. Are instro jazz folks really pretty anti-vocal jazz (which is weird to me, it's not like Trane didn't love trad jazz with his whole heart & any head has to give it up for Louis Armstrong imo) or don't take it as "seriously" (all obv baggage of a word like "serious" unavoidable here I guess). To me, especially when you get into Billie or Betty Carter, we're talking about records without I would consider any jazz basics collection incomplete, not that I'm a great authority on jazz but it just seems like there's a discourse at work that privileges some things in a list that like, tryin to unpack what that discourse is about

argh im gonna have to redo it now

lol

sorry j0hn, everyone please answer him over here
BEST EVER JAZZ ALBUM (from rateyourmusic.com) redone(AGAIN)

good grief.

herman I just gotta give you love & respect man because you are for real on this poll ish. if I ever become a boxer (don't anybody hold their breath though, would have to reverse time) I want you in my corner